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Previous generations forged by extreme hardship and long and bloody wars created some of the most progressive legislation to protect everyone from extreme poverty, disease and hunger. The previous generation fought against income inequality by means of taxation in an attempt to level the playing field, the era of the quasi aristocratic robber barons was thought to be over. Education was deemed to be a right and not a luxury. This culminated in the sixties and its heady days of protest and boom.

Since then there has been a slow and gradual clawing back of social reform and income inequality has returned to pre Great Depression levels; with all that that entails. Driven on by relentless propaganda we first passed through the "greed is good" era to what I am now beginning to see as the petty generation.

What do I mean by the petty generation?

A vision where the victim is the criminal.

The poorest are to be derided as scroungers, welfare queens and a pox on society an easy targets for media outrage. Struggling single mothers are painted as the lowest of the low and as a reason for society's decline rather than as a result.

Union workers are seen as a privileged class and unions themselves as an evil to be crushed. After all as responsible adults we can negotiate with the powerful for a good living wage as we are all so intelligent and hard to replace. The last time I advertised for a position in my business I had over 200 applications and a number offered to work for free for the much needed experience, and these were people with post grad degrees.

Government workers are painted as lazy and overpaid and non essential to a functioning democracy. all except the symbol of our power; the military. Oh and of course the bits we need at any given time that might affect our lives at that particular moment, parks, natural disasters and flying home for the weekend, you know, the essential bits.

We only react when we ourselves are affected and the "common wisdom" is that the root cause of this lies in others less well off than ourselves. We should therefore take from those least able to defend themselves and give to the most privileged in the vain hope of their generosity that some will trickle back down to us.

There has been resistance to this major shift in perception that we are being held back by the poor and that the rich will through the goodness of their own hearts create a better society. Funny how this has never worked in the past, but still is given credence.

When the richest fuck up the economy they are not only pardoned but almost encouraged to keep doing the same things again. When the poorest try the same daylight robbery they are imprisoned and impoverished further.

Education has become a luxury and and a continuing financial burden for all but the wealthiest.

An indebted population from cradle to grave is now the norm. Housing costs, education costs and declining income have seen to that.

The fight for a living wage is mocked on a daily basis yet extreme wealth is glorified. When the richest return a crumb or two the are heralded as true philanthropists, oh the charity.

Any resistance to this is painted as anarchy, just look how the occupy movement was corralled and crushed, look at the image of it painted by the MSM.

Yet on the other side; petty and selfish behavior was well funded by some of the richest people in the country and is causing the government shutdown at the moment. This same petty mindedness is driving the austerity programs in Europe and is also emboldening the return of fascist philosophy.

It is amazing to me how the poorest are perceived as the threat; yet the richest are walking away with the swag. Any attempt to address this imbalance is labelled as socialism, as if the way of the world was to have the maximum number of poor to feed the greed of the few.

As this imbalance continues to grow the corporate mouthpiece of the rich the MSM continues the daily attacks on the remnants of the "Great Society" soon there will be nothing left at all.

To me the attacks on a Affordable Care Act as some form of socialism are telling and a sign societal decline, forced to buy health care from a corporation is socialism, well color me purple indeed.

Medicare and social security are under daily attack, since both these programs have the financial sector drooling at the prospect of access to these revenue streams. As we all know the money would be safe in their hands, ha ha ha.

There is a reason faith or trust in government is at an all time low and that is because it has ceased to represent the majority for the gain of the few, yet any resistance to this is crushed by prevailing meme that government is somehow essentially bad. It's a vicious circle, one driven by pettiness, jealousy and fear.

There are still signs of hope, but little direct resistance. The daily drone from those that know and those that just plain hate is almost deafening.

I have always been of the opinion that lending a helping hand even if sometimes you get bitten in return, in the end is the way forward. This should also be the principle by which we are governed, rather than giving the wealth and power to a few and expecting it will all work out in the end.

Call me a socialist if you will, I'll embrace the compliment.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Tip Jar. Just some rambling thoughts make of (174+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    ZedMont, My Spin, nancat357, churchylafemme, Pluto, fumie, Kevskos, Situational Lefty, ActivistGuy, Mark Mywurtz, Dianna, riverlover, thomask, duhban, DeadHead, LeftHandedMan, jbou, hannah, NonnyO, Joy of Fishes, jbsoul, roseeriter, i dunno, Habitat Vic, undercovercalico, Burned, CwV, a2nite, Lovo, boophus, P Carey, qua, rogerdaddy, newpioneer, ChemBob, cskendrick, StrayCat, Retroactive Genius, AJ in Camden, cheerio2, Thinking Fella, Eric Twocents, Kristina40, irate, gulfgal98, JVolvo, pat bunny, karmsy, 3goldens, Phoebe Loosinhouse, Cartoon Messiah, DRo, corvo, jayden, bsmechanic, tommyfocus2003, Panama Pete, kerflooey, MadRuth, GwenM, theKgirls, envwq, DaveinBremerton, Heart of the Rockies, buckstop, BachFan, Justus, Smoh, Infected Zebra, golem, implicate order, Matilda, Tara the Antisocial Social Worker, puckmtl, flatford39, SherwoodB, dotsright, Empower Ink, RFK Lives, Crashing Vor, northerntier, cybersaur, Limelite, sandblaster, Dartagnan, shortgirl, countwebb, fugwb, Joieau, davidincleveland, onionjim, Chi, rmonroe, flycaster, high uintas, gundyj, sodalis, martini, 88kathy, NoMoreLies, NBBooks, Ree Zen, Pacifist, TiaRachel, TrueBlueDem, TracieLynn, zerelda, Shippo1776, philipmerrill, HCKAD, sfbob, deha, mrsgoo, flitedocnm, Jim P, Preston S, furrfu, parse this, Pariah Dog, OleHippieChick, Nulwee, BlueDragon, The Hindsight Times, JesseCW, jnhobbs, roses, basquebob, Mila18, tidalwave1, JG in MD, Tunk, quagmiremonkey, maggiejean, BlueJessamine, enhydra lutris, blue muon, tofumagoo, notrouble, ksuwildkat, DSC on the Plateau, wader, SteelerGrrl, deeproots, Nicci August, JDWolverton, misshelly, Puddytat, cpresley, TheDuckManCometh, VTCC73, greengemini, Wolf10, yawnimawke, EdSF, MHB, Vienna Blue, Involuntary Exile, ItsSimpleSimon, zmom, notdarkyet, Gottlieb, psnyder, sillycarrot, annieli, greenearth, kurt, Ed in Montana, glitterscale, Oaktown Girl, Meteor Blades, MKinTN, Spirit of Life, AoT, splashy

    it what you will

    "Another world is not only possible, she is on her way. On a quiet day, I can hear her breathing." Arundhati Roy

    by LaFeminista on Sat Oct 12, 2013 at 11:17:15 PM PDT

  •  Yes it is scary when you have close family members (27+ / 0-)

    that are so against the government and so afraid of the black man in the white house and Obamacare even when it could help them. I just do not get it.

    "I want my fair share, and that's all of it" - Charles Koch

    by nancat357 on Sat Oct 12, 2013 at 11:33:21 PM PDT

    •  I get it because the propaganda has been going (26+ / 0-)

      on for so long now to such an extent that blaming the victim is normal.

      "Another world is not only possible, she is on her way. On a quiet day, I can hear her breathing." Arundhati Roy

      by LaFeminista on Sat Oct 12, 2013 at 11:34:48 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  So, the fundamental question is: (6+ / 0-)

        Given how our society has been totally restructured, with the complicity of a very "petty" (to use your bon mot) Supreme Court, to give the corporate structures of the ultra-wealthy super-person status, able to use unlimited amounts of $$$$ to cement in place systemic corruption at the very highest levels and to finance relentless and insidious propaganda that now permeate every level of society, while shielded from all accountability and redress that ordinary citizens face daily, and in the face of a fully developed National Security State that is capable of brutally suppressing any attempt at effective organizing or dissent --

        HOW DO WE FIX THIS?

        •  Punish the perpetrators (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          MHB, nancat357, greenearth

          The ballot box is the official tool we have and that's why it's been so viscously attacked by the GOP through aggressive (and unpunished) gerrymandering and extensive voter suppression.  They fear getting booted out.

          Only about half of potential voters actually take the time to vote and far too many of those who do don't have enough information to make a good choice.  They get swayed by attack ads, the bad information they get from our lousy TM, or by the racist, poor-bashing, immigrant hatred messages the GOP embeds in their heads which cause them to vote against their own best interests.

          The only thing that really opens their eyes is when problems appear at their own doorsteps and affect them personally.  That's starting to happen.

          We need to offer solutions and not just point fingers.  Democrats have to stop being "the other guys are worse Party".  Populism is popular and a coordinated campaign contrasting the Your On Your Own country the GOP views with a Democratic vision of what our country should be would be successful if it showed voters how they and their families would benefit.

          Pointing fingers is fine, but what really matters is how we would make things better.

          The only other option is torches and pitchforks.

          There already is class warfare in America. Unfortunately, the rich are winning.

          by Puddytat on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 11:55:04 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  Aldous Huxley (9+ / 0-)

        I live in a blue community in one of the bluest states and people here actually hate me for talking about these things.  There's plenty of the 'pee cup for welfare users' resentment/bullying and that's gotten me in trouble on Facebook, too.  

        The youth generation largely does not care (which in some respects is the same as every youth generation) but the times are so much more critically dynamic. Maybe 1% of the acquaintances and friends my age actually appreciate me discussing these things. They have been drugged with electronic addictions. They live in perhaps the most exciting time in history and they're bored.

        Governments care only as much as their citizens force them to care. Nothing changes unless we change -- George Monbiot.

        by Nulwee on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 09:38:20 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Not every generation. (8+ / 0-)

          The youth of the depression era and WWII cared deeply. They made the New Deal possible.

          The youth of my generation cared deeply. We marched for civil rights and against an insane war in Vietnam. We made the Great Society possible, and we brought down Richard Nixon.

          Yes, there was always push back. There will always be apathy and resignation. But we were well informed by a media that wasn't poisoned by corporate corruption and the Prime Directive of false equivalency.

          Watergate couldn't happen today. Not because the most powerful are less venal and corrupt -- but because they are much, much more venal and corrupt. The theft of the national wealth by the oligarchs is a gazillion times worse than Watergate, and there is zero accountability.

          •  And our generation had OWS. (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            MHB, greenearth, glitterscale

            But the majority itself do not really care. The hippies were always a minority. And if you think otherwise, show me how you explain the 80s and 90s and the most fucked up generation that has ever existed.

            Governments care only as much as their citizens force them to care. Nothing changes unless we change -- George Monbiot.

            by Nulwee on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 09:57:41 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  Our generation -- the boomers (4+ / 0-)

            Some of us marched in the '60s and began voting for Democrats, and remained progressive.  Unfortunately, a lot of us became "Reagan Democrats"  and later, Tea Party supporters, forming (along with the "quiet generation" -- born in the thirties) part of the Republican lock on the over 60 group for the last 20 years.

            Recent polls show that group wising up to how bad the R's are for them, their children and their grandchildren.  Even now, the "fallback" R position on the shutdown and the debt ceiling is "entitlement cuts."  That "anvil" should be sinking them as we write.

            I just hope Dems don't blow it with chained CPI or something.

            The GOP: "You can always go to the Emergency Room."

            by Upper West on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 11:33:12 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

        •  tipped for this: (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          MHB, greenearth, glitterscale, Nulwee

          "They have been drugged with electronic addictions. They live in perhaps the most exciting time in history and they're bored."

          Well put indeed.

          “Vote for the party closest to you, but work for the movement you love.” ~ Thom Hartmann 6/12/13

          by ozsea1 on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 12:20:28 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  I'm a [old] millennial, and that's completely NOT (0+ / 0-)

          my experience at all.  Maybe its where I live (DC-ish), but my friends are all incredibly politically active and care very deeply about social justice.  Much more so than my parent's generation.  

    •  Thing is, that's just it: A black helping hand (6+ / 0-)

      is more terrifying than one with a gun in it, from that perspective.

  •  It started when overt racism became uncool (17+ / 0-)

    The shift started when it started to become uncool to hang colored people for being colored.  That's when the racists transitioned from using overt race words and overtly race based anti-black policies to code words and implicitly race based anti-black policies.

    (This is exemplified, for example, by Lee Atwater's Southern Strategy.)

    The only "problem" is that these new policies merely disproportionately hurt colored people...a lot of poor white people also get caught in the line of fire.

    But by the end of the Reagan Era, the racists have completely internalized the rhetoric...they basically equate poor with colored.

  •  And then came Reagan (26+ / 0-)
    Previous generations forged by extreme hardship and long and bloody wars created some of the most progressive legislation to protect everyone from extreme poverty, disease and hunger.
    The previous generation fought against income inequality by means of taxation in an attempt to level the playing field, ...
    Education was deemed to be a right and not a luxury.
    And then came Reagan
    The poorest are to be derided as scroungers, welfare queens and a pox on society an easy targets for media outrage.
    Union workers are seen as a privileged class and unions themselves as an evil to be crushed.
    Government workers are painted as lazy and overpaid and non essential to a functioning democracy.
    The country has gone down hill since Reagan made Socialism a bad word.  Reference Reagan's famous quote
    The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'
    •  Reagan was a response to momentous change (15+ / 0-)

      that was immediately recognized but clearly upset the ruling class.

      Two of them happened in 1971, the separation of the dollar from the bands of gold and voting rights for 18 year olds.
      These two greatly augmented the Freedom of Information Act that was passed in 1965.
      Then came the end of mandatory conscription in 1973, which effectively freed all men from being sent to their deaths on a whim.

      Absent these legislative changes it really wasn't possible to have real democracy, government by the people. Whatever the promise of the Constitution was, it was impossible to realize, until these changes took place.
      The old ruling class is still freaked by the upheavals in the cities in the sixties, which they have been destroying cities to prevent happening again ever since. Civic virtue flowers in places where people are living in close proximity to each other. When people are dispersed, it is imperative that it's every man for himself. The suburbanization of the U.S. was not a happenstance; it was a strategy to manage unruly populations -- the exact same reason it was implemented by our military in Iraq to segregate the population into manageable enclaves. Suburbanization is just a form of segregation without overt racial motivation but the same results.
      Imagine it as each horse or cow in its own stall. Material "comfort" has been exchanged for the freedom to roam. Human husbandry has an additional innovation in that there are also mobile stalls/cages in which people are contained as they transit from home to work and back. Car culture. The irony is that the people strapped into them actually perceive their mobility is enhanced as long as they are not stalled on the highway.

      •  Car Culture (7+ / 0-)

        Some of us actually kind of like it. It's nice to be horizonally mobile those years when I wasn't upwardly mobile.

        Plus having the skills to stuff an SVO engine into a porthole Pinto and to assemble a '51 Commander  Starlight from a pile of abandoned parts can be enough to keep your brain and self esteem alive all those years when yuppie HR, pet playing professors, and even aging vegan hippies thought that you were a talentless loser off the pig farm.

        Maybe the Petty Generation is the Boomers. The older ones the thougth that the sun revolved around them when it wasn't shining out of their ass. And then sweetened it by voting their credit cards for Reagan to keep the idelaism of the '60s alive. Then the younger end (my end, ugh) who bought into the Reagan Rambo jock culture Conservativism.

        "If this Studebaker had anymore Atomic Space-Age Style, you'd have to be an astronaut with a geiger counter!"

        by Stude Dude on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 06:31:21 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Reagan Rambo jock culture Conservativism (10+ / 0-)

          That's the token conservative that I used to work with. He yammered on and on about winning the lottery and moving to Las Vegas to date strippers and Playboy models. His license plate still features the year of his HS graduation, 1986, when "things were better." Of course they were better, you were a kid; you didn't have any responsibilities.

          Last I saw he was posting anti-government screeds... from a public library.

          I'm living in America, and in America you're on your own. America's not a country. It's just a business.

          by CFAmick on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 08:09:17 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Car culture crosses all of the spectrum (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          LaFeminista, sfbob, JesseCW, Stude Dude

          If you are a born gear head you just are :) One of my best friends, a true blue socialist raving liberal progressive since forever has been a gear head since he tried to make his binky race.

          And daddy won't you take me back to Muhlenberg County Down by the Green River where Paradise lay. Well, I'm sorry my son, but you're too late in asking Mister Peabody's coal train has hauled it away. John Prine

          by high uintas on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 09:15:09 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Except that generation Reagan and the (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Stude Dude

          Yuppies came later. Herb Cain called them "the me generation", kids who were in College in the 80s, though others have used that term to identify those late boomers into fitness, self-realization and the like self-centered (as opposed to greed-centric self-centeredness) activities. Part of the confusion has to do with the whole definition of boomer (43 to 60 versus 46 to 64) and the whole generation jones issue.

          By and large, a sub-cohort of very late boomers and another of early Xers augmented by the more seriously conservative, bourgeois, priveleged and wealth centric of the boomers and silent generation were generation Reagan.

          That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

          by enhydra lutris on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 10:51:19 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  Yes, though I'd add this event from 7/2/1964 (5+ / 0-)

        This upset quite a few folks and drove them into Nixon/Reagan's arms

        Unfortunately, this slick shit made it ok on the surface for too many...    :o(

        As of 9pm 8/30/13: RETIRED Pie Warrior. Substance over Sh*t Flinging (as best as I am able) ~ JV

        by JVolvo on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 06:39:51 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Thanks. I find that I don't have a real good (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          JVolvo

          memory for dates. Even now that I've mentally connected the events, I keep having to look up when they actually happened. LOL
          So, I leave out much else that happened in the sixties, just so I don't have to look it up. :)

      •  Have you ever seen a car commercial with a car (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        hannah, OleHippieChick

        portrayed as it actually is? You see the most car commercials on the evening news? These readers are paid to sell car commercials so their news will never refer to things as they actually are either.

        Only gun owners can control their guns and they say oopsie way too much. I lost it, I forgot it, it just went off. Support Gun Kill Speed Limits and Gun Ownership Speed Limits.

        by 88kathy on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 09:02:14 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  I love Michael J. Fox (0+ / 0-)

      but I hate Alex P. Keaton -- who made it cute and cool to be conservative, compared to his hopeless hippy parents.

      The GOP: "You can always go to the Emergency Room."

      by Upper West on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 11:34:37 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  For all the above reasons (8+ / 0-)

    I'm an anarcho-socialist and fuck 'em if they can't handle it.

    One day this precariat they've created will go off in their hands like the time bomb that it is.  Then ONLY the likes of me will be able to put the pieces back together.  I individually will no doubt be gone to renew the nutrients of the soil by then.  My own calling is simply to secure my own replacement.  I'm fine with that.  And the youngest among you may someday have reason to be grateful for that calling.

    Clap On, Clap Off, The Clapper!

    by ActivistGuy on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 12:23:35 AM PDT

  •  asdf (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Joy of Fishes

    ...better the occasional faults of a government that lives in a spirit of charity, than the consistent omissions of a government frozen in the ice of its own indifference. -FDR, 1936

    by James Allen on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 12:31:02 AM PDT

    •  damn (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      LaFeminista, Joy of Fishes

      ...better the occasional faults of a government that lives in a spirit of charity, than the consistent omissions of a government frozen in the ice of its own indifference. -FDR, 1936

      by James Allen on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 12:31:55 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Perception and reality. (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        LeftHandedMan

        "Another world is not only possible, she is on her way. On a quiet day, I can hear her breathing." Arundhati Roy

        by LaFeminista on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 01:02:40 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Here (8+ / 0-)

        Hopefully not too small, I'm always cautious about blowing out the sides of the comment thread.

        I am a Loco-Foco. I am from the Elizabeth Warren wing of the Democratic Party.

        by LeftHandedMan on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 01:06:09 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  This is my go to (4+ / 0-)

          You Tube cut and paste template video, which I keep in an unpublished diary draft called "LeftHandedMan's Diary Template" for easy access to formatting stuff I use frequently but don't want to memorize like Rain Man.

          This is what it looks like if you take out the <> and replace them with () so that everybody can just see the code itself.

          (iframe width="350" height="259" src="http:" frameborder="0" defang_allowfullscreen="")(/iframe)
          this is the link after the http: / and second slash that don't like to appear /
          www.youtube.com/embed/rPUNooNrwLw
          if you cut and paste everything in the above link after the : in http: and put the angle brackets back in it should work.
          QPKKQnijnsM is the YouTubeSpeak "name" for the video about income inequality
          As in:
          www.youtube.com/embed/QPKKQnijnsM
          Which gives you this:

          If you knew all this, and something just goofed, ignore me. Or enjoy the Dr. Laura West Wing takedown. :)

          I am a Loco-Foco. I am from the Elizabeth Warren wing of the Democratic Party.

          by LeftHandedMan on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 01:41:06 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  You might add that some web pages (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            LeftHandedMan, JVolvo

            do not recognize the iframe script and require the old long form which one can find by clicking "old code" and other sites have gone to just using the link address to embed. Word Press, a web page program, recognizes all three versions of youtube codes, but the manager of a site has a choice when setting up a site.

            Bluehampshire likes the bare link address and shows code as text

            Hannah Blog goes with either the iframe or the long form

            Dkos goes with either iframe or long form, if one puts back the http + colon; the bare link is just a clickable link

            Some variation may also be browser dependent and/or operating system dependent.

          •  That is one (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            LeftHandedMan

            of my favorite scenes from The West Wing!

            I love how it exposes the hypocrisy of people who mine the Bible for specific quotes that support their closed-mindedness.

            Stand Up! Keep Fighting! Paul Wellstone

            by RuralLiberal on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 06:29:51 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  Thanks, I know youtube quit working. I hardly (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            BlueDragon, LeftHandedMan

            go there anymore. It used to be kind of fun to post a youtube and share a smile on the internet.

            I know there are work arounds. I just don't want to work that hard to promote a site I am mad at right now.

            Thanks tho.

            Only gun owners can control their guns and they say oopsie way too much. I lost it, I forgot it, it just went off. Support Gun Kill Speed Limits and Gun Ownership Speed Limits.

            by 88kathy on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 09:06:57 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  It really is easy (3+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              88kathy, BlueDragon, LeftHandedMan

              not a hard workaround at all. If you want me to teach you kosmail me and I'll show you. When you aren't mad at it, of course.

              And daddy won't you take me back to Muhlenberg County Down by the Green River where Paradise lay. Well, I'm sorry my son, but you're too late in asking Mister Peabody's coal train has hauled it away. John Prine

              by high uintas on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 09:17:50 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

  •  I don't know I think greed and selfness is nothing (4+ / 0-)

    new.

    The robber barons, the so called gilded age, the use of US military against unions etc etc. America has a long and rather fucked up history that isn't always pleasant. Perhaps  it's the inherent libertarianism that was present even to a small extent since the beginning. I am really not sure.

    What I am sure of is that it's a process and an iterative one. We are generally speaking better off in every way then we were hundred years ago. Has some gains been lost? Perhaps but we've always had victories too.

    It's never over and probably never will be. Even in that 'social paradise' called Europe there's a constant balancing act as conditions change and only sometimes is that change positive.

    Der Weg ist das Ziel

    by duhban on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 01:13:38 AM PDT

    •  We have over the last few deacades taken (18+ / 0-)

      a retrograde step, income inequality id on the rise, basic essentials are getting more expensive and dire poverty on the rise. We are still better off on average, but that is shifting in a negative way. Real poverty exists and if the erosion continues for much longer we will have conditions similar to those we once thought we had left behind for good.

      "Another world is not only possible, she is on her way. On a quiet day, I can hear her breathing." Arundhati Roy

      by LaFeminista on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 01:18:54 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I disagree that on the balance the change (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Sparhawk, Whatithink

        has been negative. I think in some aspects that yes things have been reversed but that doesn't mean those changes are permanent. And I do reject that the current trajectory is negative. I'd say that at worst (or best) it's pretty much a flat line with things like the ACA promising much positive change.

        I do agree with your overall sentiment that we are at a crossroads, that likely the next half decade at most will have a profound and far reaching effect on the nation. Personally  speaking I hope we choose wisely and correctly.

        Yes real poverty still exists and sadly it will probably always exist to one extent or another. That's not to say that there are not things that need changing on that front, there are. But honestly there always are. Life and society is a process and a journey not a destination.

         That said I don't agree with the pessimism at all. But that to me is a personal choice based mainly on both how I view the world overall and what motivates me. So I choose to look at the good while we work at what needs to be worked on.

        peace

        Der Weg ist das Ziel

        by duhban on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 01:39:37 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  But what "good" things (7+ / 0-)

          can we reflect on right now that can give pause and suggest being pessimistic is not being realistic?

          Honestly sometimes this whole "positive thought" ideology is in my mind a specifically American stance that simply helps to prop up the exiting system. I am not saying you are of that ilk, but thing of how many con job schemes start with the idea that if you just visualize and think positively you can become rich. Oh.... dear the reason you did not achieve success is because you weren't positive enough. I reside somewhere between "doom and gloom" and "tra la la life is wonderful" and yes I do agree we make personal choices about our outlook. But I am not going to tell somebody who is unemployed, underemployed, or homeless, that they just need to "reframe" and think positive thoughts and work harder and smarter to get out of their hole either.

          •  Well, we've forced multi-national petro corps to (7+ / 0-)

            pay all their costs AND pay to mitigate every aspect of their industry, we've crushed the insidious threat to our food supply from GMOs and we've brought the Wall St banksters to heel.

            There!

            Oh, shit.

            As of 9pm 8/30/13: RETIRED Pie Warrior. Substance over Sh*t Flinging (as best as I am able) ~ JV

            by JVolvo on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 06:43:57 AM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  GMOs aren't dangerous (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              duhban, misslegalbeagle

              Every study confirms this.

              (-5.50,-6.67): Left Libertarian
              Leadership doesn't mean taking a straw poll and then just throwing up your hands. -Jyrinx

              by Sparhawk on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 07:39:09 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  asdf... (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                JVolvo

                 photo notsure_zps14f75736.jpg

                'If you want to be a hero, well just follow me.' - J. Lennon

                by Clive all hat no horse Rodeo on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 12:37:38 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  leave the anti science stupidity to the Tea Party (0+ / 0-)

                  Der Weg ist das Ziel

                  by duhban on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 01:31:01 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  What did you sat, hypocrite? nt (0+ / 0-)

                    'If you want to be a hero, well just follow me.' - J. Lennon

                    by Clive all hat no horse Rodeo on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 03:22:01 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  *say nt (0+ / 0-)

                      'If you want to be a hero, well just follow me.' - J. Lennon

                      by Clive all hat no horse Rodeo on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 03:22:59 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                    •  sorry I shouldn't have assumed you even know (0+ / 0-)

                      what science actually is.

                      My bad

                      Der Weg ist das Ziel

                      by duhban on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 05:10:51 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  Hypocrite. (1+ / 0-)
                        Recommended by:
                        JVolvo
                        The same as you have, absolutely none. In (4+ / 0-)

                        replying to your baseless and groundless assertions, I said I follow the evidence and suggested that you consider trying it sometime. You can start by proving your various assertions and insinuations about what Obama thyinks and feels and then about the thoughts and feelings of all of the others you have made assertrions about.

                        That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

                        by enhydra lutris on Sat Oct 12, 2013 at 09:07:56 PM PDT

                             

                        There's no point in me offering evidence (0+ / 0-)

                            as your mind is closed and I'm not going to waste my time.

                            I've followed your conversations before, there's no convincing you and your comments here prove that. You are tripping over yourself and DeadHead in order to defend his hypocrisy. You call it an ad hom apparently unaware of what a real ad hom is (here's a hint pointing out what someone is doing isn't one) and now you want me to try and change your mind?

                            I tell you what you demonstrate some good faith and we'll talk but I'm not going to waste my time and right now trying to prove anything to you is a waste of time because you don't want to listen.

                            Der Weg ist das Ziel

                            by duhban on Sat Oct 12, 2013 at 09:15:13 PM PDT

                        could you be more arrogantly conceited? (0+ / 0-)

                        Let's just for the sure hell of it assume you are right (and that's assume) what in the hell makes you think I am going to listen to you?

                        Do you make a habit of listening to conceited, pompous arrogant individuals on the nets? Cause that's what you sound like to me.

                        by duhban on Mon Sep 16, 2013 at 04:06:54 PM PDT

                        yes (0+ / 0-)

                        The worst thing in the world is to be a hypocrite. You say one thing and then do another. It's honorless but hey laugh if you want. Can't really say I care given that I don't know you and given your hypocrisy not sure I want to.

                        Der Weg ist das Ziel

                        by duhban on Sat Oct 12, 2013 at 08:32:19 PM PDT

                        So, got anything to add, hypocrite?

                        'If you want to be a hero, well just follow me.' - J. Lennon

                        by Clive all hat no horse Rodeo on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 05:33:08 PM PDT

                        [ Parent ]

              •  Utter bullshit. Studies sponsored by Monsanto (0+ / 0-)

                by chance?  Or did ConAgra put up some $$, too?

                As of 9pm 8/30/13: RETIRED Pie Warrior. Substance over Sh*t Flinging (as best as I am able) ~ JV

                by JVolvo on Mon Oct 14, 2013 at 08:38:56 AM PDT

                [ Parent ]

          •  This! (6+ / 0-)
            Honestly sometimes this whole "positive thought" ideology is in my mind a specifically American stance that simply helps to prop up the exiting system.
          •  really? (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            undercovercalico

            well let's see

            The ACA will be saving lots of people significant amounts of money

            Syria is disarming it's chemical weapons and we don't have to do a thing

            I mean really I could go on and on. See that's the thing about pessimism imo it's so wrapped up in 'life sucks' that it can't recognize the good. There's a difference between what I am saying and get rich quick schemes.

            Der Weg ist das Ziel

            by duhban on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 01:33:06 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Eh we differ (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              duhban

              I am glad it will save people money especially since I am one with a decent employer backed insurance. It is definitely better than nothing. But it is not as good as single payer in terms of cost and access. Now I am not one of these people blaming Obama for not making that one a priority, he did what he could.

              However, it does not change the fact that the average worker has fewer rights and fewer options to organize and is more unequal compared to elites than he or she was 30 years ago. Comparative CEO salaries have kaboomed compared to that of workers.

              Student debt could be turning young people into a lost generation. Most people are a paycheck or two away from being destitute and have no retirement savings. Nothing is changing from a structural or legislative point of view to suggest that these things will change any time soon. I am not suggesting you should be pessimistic, I am explaining why I am. I don't think life sucks for me, I have a job and shelter and a decent job. But I know it wouldn't take much to change all that. I could walk into work tomorrow for example after the bean counters decide they could hire less experienced nurses for less money as a cost cutting measure and there would not be much I could do to reverse it. I wouldn't see that as an "opportunity", it would be bad, and that kind of shit happens to people all the time. I don't see where individuals have very much power over their economic destiny.

              •  no it's not (0+ / 0-)

                but what a lot of people can't seem to accept is the GOP and Reagan won the war on 'can the government do good things' almost 30 years. Trust me I grew up in a Reagan democrat family and still to this day get to hear at every family meeting how incompetent the government is.

                You don't change that by swinging for the fences you do it incrementally while allowing the really liberal states to experiment which is exactly what the ACA does.

                I don't doubt there's downsides out there but there are always downsides. My grandparents grew up in the depression when 10 cents was a big deal and then survived WW2. So yes we fight, we move forward and we struggle but I don't get the pessimism and honestly? I don't think I ever want to.

                You take care

                Der Weg ist das Ziel

                by duhban on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 05:14:10 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

        •  It's not just that wealth is unequal (4+ / 0-)

          it's the how and the why of it. Most of us are working more in exchange for lesser education and worse health care. Labor is taxed at a higher rate than capital. Capital has far more taxpayer subsidies legislated into it than do citizens. Life is measured in spreadsheets and actuary tables.

          I'm living in America, and in America you're on your own. America's not a country. It's just a business.

          by CFAmick on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 08:16:27 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  How old are you? (10+ / 0-)

          You clearly don't have knowledge of what was and what now is.

          For starters, our wages haven't grown since the '70s.  That is a huge change.  And employers nowadays churn employees deliberately to keep wages low.

          Our tax structure has changed enormously, and that has affected everything public.  We can no longer afford to build anything, repair anything, and pay for services.  All I hear is a steady drumbeat of how we can't.

          I feel sorry for school kids and college kids nowadays.  The schools don't provide nearly the programs my public schools had, and college is ridiculously expensive.

          Even my grandfather, a hard core repub, said in the mid '90s that he wouldn't want to raise a family nowadays, and he had my mom during the depression.

          The banks have a stranglehold on the political process. Mike Whitney

          by dfarrah on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 08:37:53 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

    •  Agreed. My mother, who was born in 1907, (12+ / 0-)

      could have been a poster child for the Cons. It's not a generational thing. Perhaps we could say it is a personality, one that exhibits what we call the "seven deadly sins" but does so unintentionally and without reaping any long-term benefit. Indeed, they are as miserable at the end as at the beginning. In a moment of fever-induced delusion, my mother's brain actually articulated the problem accurately when it said, "I don't know how to live" and followed that almost immediately with "I wonder whose fault that is."
      Keep in mind that at that point she had lived for 95 years, despite having broken bones 27 times because she never "looked where she was going" on three continents and in more than a dozen cities. Her constant going may have been part of the explanation for her longevity. Any inconvenience prompted her to up and leave. She never stuck around to let difficulties turn into problems. In a sense it was always "après moi le déluge" with her. She was an unthinking opportunist. I think people forgave her her insults because they were unintentional. If she was mean, and she was, it was because some unrealistic expectation had not been satisfied. She inflicted damage like a mosquito seeking blood. Nothing personal.
      We make the mistake of accepting how such personalities describe themselves as accurate. We take them at their word, instead of paying attention to what they do. If we paid attention to their actions, we could tell when they are about to inflict damage, because their modus operandi is always the same, and call a halt. But, we have to let them talk because such personalities tend to be very voluble -- it's how they get their way -- and their talk will give their agenda away.
      That we have a large number of such personalities in Congress should not come as a surprise. Congress is for talkers. People who don't like to speak in public, admire people who do it easily and so they send them into the public arena. That these people do not know what they are talking about doesn't occur to people who don't talk because they are often not sure of what they know. They assume that, if people talk, they know, just as they assume that, if people are rich, they are smart. That they might be thieves and compulsive thieves at that, does not occur to people who are honest as the day is long.
      There's a reason we have Congressional elections every two years. They're an opportunity to weed out the incompetents. They don't recognize themselves and self-select out. They have to be weeded out. Since we do it metaphorically, it won't kill them. We just have to identify who's a weed, and who's not.

      •  Not so much 'generational' in the way we (0+ / 0-)

        usually see the term -- as a cohort of people born within X number of years -- but in a more general sense.  

      •  Congress critters are also (0+ / 0-)

        big with ego (which is almost a prerequisite given the kinds of things they must endure) and short on a lot of the other traits we might wish them to have.
        I really think we need to kill the bit about them having to fund raise 90 percent of their time. And maybe do something about the fact that it is mostly self selection.
        Shouldn't we look for people who work in fields that might give our body of congress some information other than law?

        It seems that all my life we have been bombing someone, teaching them a lesson. Every day I understand more deeply how violent we are. Violent to others and violent to ourselves. - Robert Olmstead

        by glitterscale on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 08:12:15 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  We've got a long way to climb back up. (8+ / 0-)

    People need to start seeing unionization as a good thing again.  Sympathy strikes, mass strikes, strike days, and all of that needs to come back.

    And I think we need to ensure that such strikes aren't just local, but worldwide.  So any massive corporation will be required to deal with a union regardless of where in the world they exist.

  •  I'm not sure that "generation" is a good fit. (14+ / 0-)

    You make many good points, and i'm concerned about our trajectory too. I also think that the right-wing denial of climate change may be even more dangerous to us all than their desire to dismantle the safety net.

    But "generation"? The Koch brothers and Ted Cruz are not a generation. The swath of conservatives covers a wide range of ages. I also hesitate to alienate any actual generation.

    See, to a large extent, my concern is for the younger people. I'm 64. Maybe the country will keep lurching on for most of my remaining time without causing me too much pain, and certainly climate change will have its most devastating effects after I'm gone. Though I don't have children, I worry about the next group, and the next, and not just Americans, but mankind.

    This country has the potential to lead the world to reverse the climate damage, and cope with the future. We're not doing a good job of it, though, and I sure can point a finger.

    Sorry for getting somewhat off topic, it's just I think there's a huge downside to ignoring the inevitable results of conservative "thought".

    •  I'd agree with your concern. Too many, even here, (5+ / 0-)

      assume FDR's New Deal is bedrock and will always be in place.  

      Not if we stand by while ReThugs chip away for their oligarch masters - as they have since Day 1- and today's Dems agree that reforms are necessary due to tax-cuts/revenue losses + out of control military expenditures = balance sheet deficits.

      Apples and Oranges yet the CW of DC is entitlement cuts. And many, many youngsters and non-political folks have grown up with the LIE that SS won't be there for them.

      Houston, we have a problem.

      As of 9pm 8/30/13: RETIRED Pie Warrior. Substance over Sh*t Flinging (as best as I am able) ~ JV

      by JVolvo on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 06:51:18 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  And it's a very old lie (4+ / 0-)

        Starting in the 60s and continuing through the 80s I was tutored, and believed, that SS wouldn't be there for me. Of course this was when politicians of all stripes just couldn't resist the temptation of all that money sitting there doing nothing and "borrowed" from it for pet projects. And I was told, and believed, that the trust was going broke at the speed of light and we ought to take what was left and... do something wlse with it. Like, HEY! Invest it in the stock market!! So, for a lot of reasons over which I had no control, I really thought that trust funs would be gone by the time I was ready for it.

        But I was forced to take early retirement last spring and you know what? SS was there for me.

        Damn good thing too because after the Great Greed Is Good Gang was finished, it was all that was left.

        Meddle not in the affairs of dragons... for thou art crunchy and good with ketchup.

        by Pariah Dog on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 09:49:46 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Excellent diary, Lafemm!! (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    DRo, LaFeminista, glitterscale

    Most of your posts are quite good, this one 'takes the cake'!!

    "Life without emotions is like an engine without fuel."

    "It's said that the honest man has nothing to hide. Not true. The honest man has to hide himself, because honest men are the prime targets of those who lie." (TY Hannah:)

    by roseeriter on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 04:37:06 AM PDT

  •  actually this is pre-depression era thinking (19+ / 0-)

    the wealthy talked about the poor being morally corrupt.  this is very similar type of talk.  ominous sign indeed for what is to come.

    "The real wealth of a nation consists of the contributions of its people and nature." -- Riane Eisler

    by noofsh on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 04:46:58 AM PDT

  •  Many many people (mostly on the right) have been (5+ / 0-)

    telling us for ages that the US is a Republic, not a democracy, but many many people weren't listening because we 'loved' the American Dream Democracy that we 'believed' we had.

    If the US had ever been a true democracy there never would have been so many Civil War(s).

    My last political desire is that I will witness a true democracy country somewhere...and in my mind a real democracy is very much the ideal of what socialism is-for all the people, by all the people. Can I have an Amen?

    "Life without emotions is like an engine without fuel."

    "It's said that the honest man has nothing to hide. Not true. The honest man has to hide himself, because honest men are the prime targets of those who lie." (TY Hannah:)

    by roseeriter on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 04:51:27 AM PDT

  •  I guess I am a socialist (8+ / 0-)

    because I like single payer health systems, affordable education, unions, government that works effectively and creates policies that help to reduce major inequities be it from class, gender, or color and I am not "against" the rich I just don't think they need any extra help staying that way. I am not "against" capitalism, I just don't think the main role of government should be to help maintain its excess at the expense of workers.

    I also kinda think the American Dream is bullshit in the sense that the assumption is that each generation should simply exist to and be measured by whether they have "more" than the previous one. The fact is post WWII America achieved economic supremacy partially because other nations were still in tatters and nobody was really competing against us. Now we have competition and against many nationals that do have vaguely socialist policies regarding worker protection and less blatant economic inequalities. And for some reason our elites seems to think we have nothing to learn from other nations.

    So I prefer socialist democracy over Dickens style authoritarianism.

  •  Thanks (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    LaFeminista

    nosotros no somos estúpidos

    by a2nite on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 05:27:44 AM PDT

  •  Wonderful essay. Thank you. (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    DRo, corvo, jayden, LaFeminista

    Peace, love and joy to you.

    Patriotism may be the last refuge of scoundrels, but religion is assuredly the first.

    by StrayCat on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 05:57:40 AM PDT

  •  Don't forget, the RW spent decades, (14+ / 0-)

    literally, sowing the meme that "taxes were evil," that "welfare encouraged laziness," that the "free market" was God, and so on. They've had a long lead-time. They've successfully brainwashed a lot of people, to the point these lies are not even questioned.

    The biggest challenge the progressive movement faces in the coming generation will be that of framing and naming.

    Thanks for the diary.

    It's here they got the range/ and the machinery for change/ and it's here they got the spiritual thirst. --Leonard Cohen

    by karmsy on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 06:48:28 AM PDT

  •  While I agree with much you've said... (10+ / 0-)

    particularly about the poor being victimized and made the criminal and about income inequality, I don't think it's a generational thing.  It's more of a confluence of ass-holes from many generations.  

    These ass-holes range from people like older guys like Cal Thomas to Arkansas' Greenberg and Huckabee to the Paul Ryans and Eric Cantors and Santorums...to the even younger Eric Ericksons...and so on.  

    The common thread seems to me to be lives of relative ease with no significant events in their lives that brought them to their knees so that they had to acknowledge that people are not always in charge of their fate and to imbue them with some sense of humanity.  

    For these people, and the many like them who are screwing the rest of us, nothing exists if they haven't experienced it or if it's opposed to their beliefs, and they discard all facts to the contrary.  So, until some tea-party ass-hole loses his/her job and, whoops, finds out it's not so easy to find another and that food stamps aren't all that generous, they're going to believe those "other people" are lazy, no good, layabout, bed-wetting liberal takers.  

    As an aside, one of my "conservative" acquaintances had just such an epiphany not long ago (due to the sequester) and is now far less of an ass-hole.  

    So..generation aside..the only way to get these people to change is for something to happen to them that HURTS them, not the other person.  Then they start to think.  

    Maybe the government shutdown is smacking a few of these folks where it hurts and they'll get the picture. Unfortunately, the Ryans and Cantors and Tom Coburns and etc., aren't being damaged by it.  Let's hope something does hurt them...soon.

    The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis. - Dante Alighieri

    by Persiflage on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 06:53:09 AM PDT

    •  I don't think it's as much a generational (4+ / 0-)

      issue as the diarist suggests.  But maybe it is, but in a different way.

      My generation fought for civil rights (women, African Americans), the environment and peace, among other worthy causes.  I am still actively pursuing these causes, but the number of young people who are participating has dropped precipitously in the last couple of decades.  They may poll well when asked about these issues or vote in favor of good policies and candidates (when they bother to vote), but I do not see the active participation that is necessary to change things.  Every organization I'm in has seen the same reduction in active participation and cannot devise effective ways to overcome it.  The cop out is that they are too busy working, raising families, etc.  Well, we were as well, and still managed to actively participate.

    •  I think "Confluence of Assholes" (4+ / 0-)

      covers intergenerational asshattery quite nicely.

      Thank you for a new and multi-purpose epithet.
      Best thing since John Kennedy Toole's Confederacy of Dunces - which I guess is a "re-Tooling" of Jonathan Swift...

  •  I believe in a strong social democracy (9+ / 0-)

    as seen in many places around the world.  People are healthier, happier, with more family oriented social policies, government better serving the people, etc.  I know that countries such as Denmark and Sweden and France and Canada far surpass the US in many measures related to the lives of their people, including less stress and more self-fulfilled lives.  Living in the US is needlessly stressful and tragically takes it toll on life expectancy, infant mortality, divorce rates, and many other measures.  

    The US is nearly lost.  May the universe, the gods and Mother Earth take us in their arms and help the American people and our country.

    A disabled Vietnam veteran who served honorably

    thomas

  •  Great Diary (6+ / 0-)

    You are entirely right in how the government has gone off course. Just because the Repubs are entirely in the pocket of corporate interests who could care less about the welfare of 99% of the country, doesn't let off the Dems as the knights riding to the rescue. They have plenty of blame as they too feed on the corporate 'tit' for their campaign financing and much more.

    When you have 99% of the income growth going to the top 1% since 2007, nothing has changed! When you have no priority of tax avoidance before you blame social programs,nothing has changed!

    When you have the President on down never mentioning 'carried interest' which allows Buffet and the succesful earners in the financial sector too pay less of a % of their income than their secretaries and the people who clean their offices at night, nothing has changed!

    Without campaign finance reforms and a concerted effort to go after the corruption and rot in our government, we are doomed.How we get there is the problem but a nonviolent revolution is what is required.

    If the consequences weren't so great, I would like to see default because it may be the spark for a revolution of social justice. But from a realpolitik viewpoint,of course there should be no shutdown and debt default.My children and grandchildren are going to ve living in a country which is based on owners and serfs with very little opportunity for advancement if this crap continues.

  •  The "I got mine" era (8+ / 0-)

    You described it perfectly.

    It's always easy to sell the myth the "bad things don't happen to good people," so anyone poor must deserve it and therefore not be entitled to any help from the rest of us.  It's soothing:  I'm a good person, I work hard, so I'll be rich any day now.

    and the ones who actually are rich laugh their way to the bank at how easily we've been manipulated.

    I shall die, but that is all that I shall do for Death; I am not on his payroll. - Edna St. Vincent Millay

    by Tara the Antisocial Social Worker on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 07:44:47 AM PDT

  •  Still not sure where I fit in (12+ / 0-)

    (1) Redneck, in the sense that someone growing up on a small farm, outside a hick town, is a redneck.

    (2) Career member of the military, steeped in the weird competing traditions of "USA! USA!", meritocracy, socialism (oh yes, we G.I's are unabashed socialists within our community), and servant leadership.

    (3) Gun owner, hunter, and conservationist.

    (4) Hemingway, Steinbeck, Will Rogers, and Gandhi are fighting for space on my bookshelf...right beside my business & management textbooks.

    (5) I work for a firm that makes military and first responder equipment (bunch o' rugged individuals hopelessly dependent on gubbermint contracts).

    (6) Can't abide by the notion of someone homeless and hungry due to economic happenstance...or for any other reason.

    (7) Don't know why the whole nation can't have the same affordable healthcare that I have.  The ACA doesn't go far enough.

    (8) Unabashed "Occupy" fan.  I'm a huge free speech junkie.

    (9) Still haven't figured out how marriage equality picks my pocket or breaks my leg.  Ditto for any other form of _____ (fill in the blank) rights.

    (10) The notion of "living wage" and the biblical notion of fair pay for work track nicely in my opinion.

    Needless to say, I lean conservative in the sense that "conserve" means something akin to "don't squander fucking everything".  But I can't hang with today's conservatives because they are the antithesis of nearly everything I believe in.

    "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win". Mohandas K. Gandhi

    by DaveinBremerton on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 07:52:14 AM PDT

  •  Call Me a Humanist (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    happymisanthropy, enhydra lutris

    with no aversion to socialism.

    Readers & Book Lovers Pull up a chair! You're never too old to be a Meta Groupie

    by Limelite on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 07:58:38 AM PDT

  •  Call me a socialist (4+ / 0-)

    but I like driving on the roads I helped pay for, even if I didnt pay enough and theyre full of holes.

    I like calling 911 when I have an emergency, so I can utilize the services I helped pay for, even if I didnt pay enough and the ambulance shows up with only one person in it and almost out of gas.

    I like paying for research into the workings of the universe, and into the dangers therein, even if I dont pay enough and we STILL havent sent a manned mission to Saturn.

    So, yeah. Call me a socialist

    "Every book is like a door"

    by Hammerhand on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 08:14:58 AM PDT

  •  Pretty obvious (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    LaFeminista, JG in MD

    how about some thoughts on why this generation is so self absorbed?

  •  Re (0+ / 0-)

    Whether you are a socialist or an anarcho-capitalist, the bills must always be paid. All tax revenue is ultimately generated by private sector economic activity. The private sector pays all the bills, all the time.

    The people of a country cannot consume more in services than they are willing to be taxed, at least for any substantial period of time. We either need to raise taxes or cut spending, however, the numbers trivially demonstrate that tax increases on the 1% alone will never be sufficient and the middle class is going to have to substantially chip in for services they want.

    (-5.50,-6.67): Left Libertarian
    Leadership doesn't mean taking a straw poll and then just throwing up your hands. -Jyrinx

    by Sparhawk on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 08:20:16 AM PDT

    •  Today capital is taxed at lower levels (6+ / 0-)

      Today that capital is transferred intact to the next generation widening the divide.

      Taxes were heavier, economic growth more sustained budgets better balanced. Today people seem to want it all and not have to pay. Hence a crumbing and dangerous infrastructure.

      "Another world is not only possible, she is on her way. On a quiet day, I can hear her breathing." Arundhati Roy

      by LaFeminista on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 09:08:27 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  If you're arguing for bigger estate taxes... (0+ / 0-)

        ...no argument here.

        However, economic growth comparisons with the 60s may well contain correlation/causation errors. In the 60s, we had a smaller economy (and population) with more room to grow. Today we might have a lot less headroom regardless of how much we tax capital. Also, China is now growing at 8% or so... does that mean we need to do everything like China does it?

        Not to mention that automation is destroying a lot of jobs, and that's something that tax policy (and minimum wage policy) is powerless to do anything about.

        I appreciate your position here, I just think the situation is a lot more complex than might commonly be understood, and the return of 70-year-old economic policies might not be the right prescription in 2014.

        (-5.50,-6.67): Left Libertarian
        Leadership doesn't mean taking a straw poll and then just throwing up your hands. -Jyrinx

        by Sparhawk on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 09:52:03 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  "Anarcho-Capitalism" is a complete (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      ZhenRen

      oxymoron.

      Only an extremely hierarchical system can force the deprived to embrace the very system of titled property that deprives them.

      Whether you call it Business or Government, if you want  capitalism (that is to say, a small number of people holding title to vital resources and using that title to extract productive labor from unwilling workers) Anarchism is off the table.
       

      "But the traitors will pretend / that it's gettin' near the end / when it's beginning" P. Ochs

      by JesseCW on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 09:57:55 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Global mean and median incomes... (0+ / 0-)

        ...are skyrocketing due to capitalism's influences.

        (-5.50,-6.67): Left Libertarian
        Leadership doesn't mean taking a straw poll and then just throwing up your hands. -Jyrinx

        by Sparhawk on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 11:13:28 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Thanks to capitalism, 17,000 children (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          sillycarrot

          will die today of malnutrition in a world where we burn corn in monster dragster tractors.  Simply because their parents cannot pay more for corn than the owners of monster dragster tractors can.

          2,000 more will die for want of potable water, because their parents cannot afford it.  

          No one, other than a sociopath, tolerates that unless the fear of overwhelming force commanded by rulers (corporate, robber baron, or Government - it makes no difference what they're called) forces them to accept it.

          Capitalism has never existed without a central authority willing to use extreme violence to enforce the concept of "title".  It's astonishingly hard to see how it possibly could.  

          It takes large armies to prevent workers from keeping what their labor has produced.

          "Anarcho-Capitalist" is a nonsense phrase as meaningless as "Islamo-Fascist".  Two totally contradictory concepts.

          "But the traitors will pretend / that it's gettin' near the end / when it's beginning" P. Ochs

          by JesseCW on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 11:49:36 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  There is nothing in your diary (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    LaFeminista, enhydra lutris

    that I can disagree with except making it a generational thing. It seems to me that Kochchokin' Teahadists cross generational lines, especially when you consider the influence of Paulistas.

    It seems to me to be some weird kind of genetic stain rather than a generational thing. Whatever it is, I hate it.

    As for socialism, I was raised in one of the most socialist states in the Union, Utah. Were in not for the socialist arm of the LDS church many people here wouldn't have a pot to pee in and since the church is our politician's main influence I have to assume they are secret socialists themselves. But it's socialism for a chosen few only.

    And daddy won't you take me back to Muhlenberg County Down by the Green River where Paradise lay. Well, I'm sorry my son, but you're too late in asking Mister Peabody's coal train has hauled it away. John Prine

    by high uintas on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 08:46:12 AM PDT

    •  maybe generation is to narrow (5+ / 0-)

      I'm really speaking of blocks of generations of about 30/40 years in length.

      1920-50
      1950-80
      1980 on

      At all times there are many generations living at the same time, however one usually has the most access power and today that is the boomers.

      "Another world is not only possible, she is on her way. On a quiet day, I can hear her breathing." Arundhati Roy

      by LaFeminista on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 09:05:24 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Many people equate the boomers with hippies. (4+ / 0-)

        Some of the boomers were hippies, but you only have to look around you to see how few. They just got a lot of publicity and many 'weekend hippies' made it look like more.

        Only gun owners can control their guns and they say oopsie way too much. I lost it, I forgot it, it just went off. Support Gun Kill Speed Limits and Gun Ownership Speed Limits.

        by 88kathy on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 09:11:43 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  La Fem...you would enjoy hearing Morris Massey's (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        LaFeminista, JG in MD

        tapes entitled "who you are is where you were when."  They are very, very good.  Here's a link to a brief on it:
         http://en.wikipedia.org/...

        Anyway, I took the Massey course years ago and still think of many things he said.  It's part of why I made my comment above.  Massy describes what he calls a SEI (Significant Emotional Event) and how a SEI can change the way people were "patterned" in their formative years.

        My other observation is that our lack of a draft or universal military service is a major reason for many of the problems we face.   If people from all walks of life were in Afghanistan, the outcry by now would be overwhelming.  As it is, most people don't even think about it.  Memorial Day has become another holiday to cook out and drink beer or go to the beach.  If it was "your" son, daughter, wife, husband, brother, etc., lying in the cold ground...well, it would be altogether different.   You can tie that to the current generation...and all since Vietnam...for part of the problem.  

        The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis. - Dante Alighieri

        by Persiflage on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 10:16:18 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Early and late boomers (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        JG in MD, high uintas

        I was born in 1949, and the progressive people I grew up with then are still progressive (with the exception of one, who earned lots of money the old-fashioned way -- he inherited it.)

        Through work, I find I have very little in common with the tail-end of the boomers, the ones in their late 40s and early 50s. They are the ones who came of age in the 1980s.

  •  I don't think you rambled a bit. A very easy read (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    LaFeminista, TiaRachel

    from top to bottom.

    When I was a little kid, I went to free day camps at parks both in downtown city and in the sticks country (we moved a lot). These day camps were led by college kids earning their way through college. Probably debt free. Because summer jobs did the job back then.

    Petty generation and it stinks.

    Only gun owners can control their guns and they say oopsie way too much. I lost it, I forgot it, it just went off. Support Gun Kill Speed Limits and Gun Ownership Speed Limits.

    by 88kathy on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 08:57:09 AM PDT

  •  I've never understood why folks are put off (5+ / 0-)
    Any resistance to this is painted as anarchy, just look how the occupy movement was corralled and crushed, look at the image of it painted by the MSM.
    by that word.  A lot of OWS, particularly in the early days, was organized along classically Anarchical principles.  

    This, in fact, offended a great many self-important people who soundly misunderstood what the movement was about, and who assumed that showing up would lead to the differential treatment to which they're accustomed.

    The problem wasn't painting the movement as Anarchical, it was conflating Anarchism with Nihilism.  

    "But the traitors will pretend / that it's gettin' near the end / when it's beginning" P. Ochs

    by JesseCW on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 09:04:40 AM PDT

    •  Italian style anarchical philosophy is one thing (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      JG in MD

      most people when anarchy is mentioned think of chaos and bomb throwing only.

      "Another world is not only possible, she is on her way. On a quiet day, I can hear her breathing." Arundhati Roy

      by LaFeminista on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 09:14:58 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Anarchism, as a term (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        JesseCW, sillycarrot

        was coined by the anti-authoritarian, anticapitalist Proudhon, who during his life was far more popular among 19th century socialists than Marx.

        Anarchists are in favor of a horizontally organized society based on free association and egalitarian power-relationships, without hierarchy of any kind, including patriarchy, oligarchy, unequal race relationships, the inequality between owning and working class, etc.

        The bomb throwing days from roughly 1880 to 1900 were only a small minority in the movement, and that period gave way to a long, rather peaceful period in the anarchist movement, since most anarchists don't support violence.

        In fact, the real source of most of the worst violence is state-sponsored. Most Democrats are thus far more supportive of rather mass scale violence that no traditional anarchist would ever support.

        "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

        by ZhenRen on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 11:42:03 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  With no intent to disparage anyone, "most" (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          ZhenRen, sillycarrot

          Anarchists support violence only in direct self defense, and then to no greater extent than absolutely necessary for survival.

          That's not to say that there are not pacifist Anarchists, but most have no ideological issue with throwing the tear gas canisters back at the cops or going for paving stones when the boot boys come with knives.

          "But the traitors will pretend / that it's gettin' near the end / when it's beginning" P. Ochs

          by JesseCW on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 11:52:50 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  True (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            sillycarrot, JesseCW

            I'm talking about terrorism, killing innocent people. Very few anarchists would support that, since it goes against everything anarchists stand for.

            Most anarchists don't support terrorism and never have, even during the violent period in the late 19th century. Anarchists don't believe in imposing authority over others, and that includes using violence to do so. Thus, they are often more peaceful in this respect than the average Democrat who thinks its okay to use violent force in invading foreign nations for US hegemonic purposes.

            Self-defense against unjust imposition of authority, especially when that authority uses violence to do so, is another matter. Here's an excellent article that covers a lot of ground on this, if anyone reading is interested.

            http://www.infoshop.org/...

            "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

            by ZhenRen on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 12:11:22 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  Violence, to me (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              sillycarrot

              has an unjustified connotation to it. Is self-defense violence, since it is justified? Is damaging property in self defense violence, if people are not hurt?

              Anyway, there are shades of meaning to this. Would a mother, no matter how pacifist, "violently" defend her children, if they were attacked? Yes, she would, in most cases, it seems to me. With every bone in her body.

              "In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

              by ZhenRen on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 12:41:53 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

  •  As Matt Taibbi put it (9+ / 0-)
    It's a classic peasant mentality: going into fits of groveling and bowing whenever the master's carriage rides by, then fuming against the Turks in Crimea or the Jews in the Pale or whoever after spending fifteen hard hours in the fields. You know you're a peasant when you worship the very people who are right now, this minute, conning you and taking your shit. Whatever the master does, you're on board. When you get frisky, he sticks a big cross in the middle of your village, and you spend the rest of your life praying to it with big googly eyes. Or he puts out newspapers full of innuendo about this or that faraway group and you immediately salute and rush off to join the hate squad. A good peasant is loyal, simpleminded, and full of misdirected anger.

    None are so hopelessly enslaved, as those who falsely believe they are free. The truth has been kept from the depth of their minds by masters who rule them with lies. -Johann von Goethe

    by gjohnsit on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 09:46:32 AM PDT

  •  Yes, petty and jealous. Jealousy has become the (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    LaFeminista

    defining American characteristic, even among many of those who self identify as liberals. "Somebody got something that I didn't get, or got it for less, or didn't work as hard, or perhaps at all, oh the horror, the horror" is some sort of cultural war cry.

    That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

    by enhydra lutris on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 10:36:50 AM PDT

  •  The "Greatest" and their spawn (0+ / 0-)

    Remember that the so called "Greatest Generation" and their baby boomer span are the root of all of this.  

    It was the "Greatest" who put Reagan in the White House.  

    It was a Boomer child of a "Greatest" - Bush the Lessor - who took us to the place we are now.  

    The "Greatest" and their spawn are like locust who devour everything in their path.

    It is well that war is so terrible -- lest we should grow too fond of it. Robert E. Lee

    by ksuwildkat on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 11:05:29 AM PDT

    •  So did "the greatest" generation (0+ / 0-)

      name themselves "the greatest generation?"  lol  They probably did.

      People should not be afraid of their governments. Governments should be afraid of their people. --V for Vendetta

      by WFBMM on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 11:53:12 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Excellent diary (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    sillycarrot

    The GOP/Rich are essentially stepping on people's necks, preventing them from getting up, while at the same time, having the nerve to say, "What's wrong with you? Why can't you stand on your own two feet, parasite!?!"

    They steal money that should be rightly put back into the economy through tax loopholes. Then, those who actually run businesses don't pay their workers a living wage.  Why? Because they're too busy accumulating wealth by hoarding money in off shore accounts and tax dodging. They also actively work to keep affordable healthcare from the poor, instead preferring that lower income people clog up hospital systems and ERs, thereby amassing debt that they can't possibly pay back in several lifetimes.  Meanwhile, the middle class picks up the tab, while the rich stay rich.

    "So, little parasites," they say, "get up, get up. Stop being lazy. Get up from beneath my boot heel and take personal responsibility for yourselves!"

    It's completely absurd.

    People should not be afraid of their governments. Governments should be afraid of their people. --V for Vendetta

    by WFBMM on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 11:50:18 AM PDT

  •  Right on / can't rec on handheld (0+ / 0-)

    Would rec this spot-on diary, but rec button is missing on phone. This happened with War on Error's Koch/IRS diary, too.

    On the radio I heard some scum thug make a dem defend Obamacare on nothing but it being socialist, just that word.  Nothing else got through. And the stupid dem stuttered and got flustered and let the tactic work. Exasperating. I don't know who it was, I was driving.

    Thanks, LF.

  •  NASCAR is ironically quite socialist given its (0+ / 0-)

    regulatory regimes and evolution from its more libertarian rumrunner origins, hence a Petty Generation

    Warning - some snark may be above‽ (-9.50; -7.03)‽ eState4Column5©2013 "I’m not the strapping young Muslim socialist that I used to be" - Barack Obama 04/27/2013

    by annieli on Sun Oct 13, 2013 at 01:59:47 PM PDT

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