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Screenshot of the entrance to the Museum of Creation & Earth
Publicly funded schools should not be teaching the same things as the Museum of Creation.
Laws that govern how evolution is and is not taught in public schools draw public debate, but privatization is the main way creationism is making inroads in publicly funded schools. That's because many states have voucher programs that include religious schools with an extreme anti-science curriculum, as Politico's Stephanie Simon found:
A POLITICO review of hundreds of pages of course outlines, textbooks and school websites found that many of these faith-based schools go beyond teaching the biblical story of the six days of creation as literal fact. Their course materials nurture disdain of the secular world, distrust of momentous discoveries and hostility toward mainstream scientists. They often distort basic facts about the scientific method — teaching, for instance, that theories such as evolution are by definition highly speculative because they haven’t been elevated to the status of “scientific law.”

And this approach isn’t confined to high school biology class; it is typically threaded through all grades and all subjects.

One set of books popular in Christian schools calls evolution “a wicked and vain philosophy.” Another derides “modern math theorists” who fail to view mathematics as absolute laws ordained by God. The publisher notes that its textbooks shun “modern” breakthroughs — even those, like set theory, developed back in the 19th century. Math teachers often set aside time each week — even in geometry and algebra — to explore numbers in the Bible. Students learn vocabulary with sentences like, “Many scientists today are Creationists.”

The vouchers that fund these schools are booming, with the number of students receiving them having risen 30 percent since 2010 and legislation proposed in 26 states to create or expand voucher programs. Of course, not all vouchers go to schools that teach that 19th-century math is insufficiently biblical, but the fact that they can should be a major national scandal. At least 300 voucher-funded schools in nine states and the District of Columbia teach creationism.

These religious schools aren't the only way vouchers and similar programs are hurting public education, of course—the explicit goal of leading voucher advocates is full privatization of education. And when I say explicit, I mean explicit: "Like most other conservatives and libertarians, we see vouchers as a major step toward the complete privatization of schooling," according to the president of the Heartland Institute in 1997. While the big spread of vouchers comes at the state level, they're very much a part of the national Republican agenda. House Majority Leader Eric Cantor, for instance, is all about vouchers. So don't be fooled by the "school choice" rhetoric. We're talking about an all-out assault on public education with a heaping dose of anti-science teaching.

Originally posted to Laura Clawson on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 07:12 AM PDT.

Also republished by Daily Kos Labor and Daily Kos.

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Comment Preferences

  •  The jokes on them (30+ / 0-)

    My generation is the most atheist generation the world has ever seen, and the next generation will be even more.

    TX-17 (Bill Flores-R), TX Sen-14 (Kirk Watson-D), TX HD-50 (Celia Israel-D). Senate ratings map (as of 3/10/14)

    by Le Champignon on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 07:17:08 AM PDT

  •  They should start Young Earth Medical Center (24+ / 0-)

    So they can get medical treatment from similar quacks.  Instead of diagnosing disease, they'll just pray and yell about liberals and Darwin.

    Actually, they should be prohibited from health care because the doctors work for Satan (Darwin).

    Republicans: Taking the country back ... to the 19th century

    by yet another liberal on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 07:23:52 AM PDT

    •  when you go to the doctor, (13+ / 0-)

      do you look at his/her degrees and where they are from?  i tell you, if any doctor or vet wants my business, he/she better have an education from a state where they understand basic biology and science.  if you got your degree at Bassackward College of the Swamps, i am getting the hell out of your office and into see someone who wanted an education, not an anti science indoctrination.  i am sorry if that hurts someone's fee fees but it is my health and life these jokers want to short circuit in the name of "god".

    •  All atheists need to have a card on them (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Paragryne, Dave925, sajiocity

      at all times saying that under no circumstances should they ever be brought to a religiously affiliated hospital for emergencies.  That is the only way atheists can be sure that they can protect their health.

      •  Well, a private ambulance service will take you (8+ / 0-)

        anywhere you pay for  ...

        But public and volunteer EMT units?  "The closest !"

        On the little island where I live, Long Island New York we are seeing a consolidation of hospital resources so that there are now three cooperating networks.  

        One is Jewish/secular ... they will honor end-of-life directives and perform sterilizations.

        One is Catholic ... and they will not.

        Then there is one "public" facility in each county to serve the poor and uninsured.   Surprisingly ... if you've got a gunshot wound or extensive burns THOSE are the places you want to go.

        •  Not surprising that public ones do trauma best (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Bronx59, JerryNA

          Public hospitals in many areas - Cook County, LA County, etc. - handle very large numbers of trauma cases. At least in bigger cities and counties, they are typically the top-level Trauma Centers (Level I) that have 24-hour staffing with all the skilled personnel needed to handle gunshot wounds, car accidents, and other major trauma. Some places also have pediatric or burn center specialties. In our area, if you have such a major trauma, you would be taken directly to a Level I center by ambulance or helicopter, if at all possible, even if another place might be closer.

          Medical specialty care is like anything else: people who practice a lot are likely to be better at it. Sadly, that applies to ER docs and their specialist colleagues who see the most victims of trauma.

      •  Eh, it's not quite that simple (7+ / 0-)

        I think all of the hospitals near me are religious affiliated - because they're all named Baptist This or Saint Joe Blow That and such. So even though I'm Atheist, if I'm having a medical emergency, I want to be taken to the closest hospital because the nearest non-religious one might be far away.

        If it were my wife, and she was pregnant, I probably wouldn't want to take her to a Catholic hospital. But I'm a guy and single, so it's currently a non-issue for me.

        Besides, my doctor is Jewish and affiliated with a Baptist hospital (even though there is a Jewish hospital here). I trust him to make the best medical choices for me because I know he's not a religious loon.

        "How come when it’s us, it’s an abortion, and when it’s a chicken, it’s an omelette?" - George Carlin

        by yg17 on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 09:26:43 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Fat chance that will work. (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        GreenMother, kfunk937, ZedMont

        My HMO has 2 choices for hospitals, both of them catholic.  If I wanted to opt out, it would cost me thousands, if not more.

        If the hospital is good, religion doesn't generally enter into it at all.

        I am not religious, and did NOT say I enjoyed sects.

        by trumpeter on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 10:08:22 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  You're right. The most you are likely to be (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          trumpeter, JerryNA

          exposed to religion in a religiously affiliated hospital is from "volunteers" who are permitted to come around to your room and offer to pray with you, and to be informed of where the chapel is, in case you want to hobble down there.

          I laugh every time I think about my Jewish friend's response to a drop-in concerned about his soul.  "Have you been saved?" she asked.

          "No," he replied, "I've been chosen."  That ended the conversation, probably because she didn't know what the hell he meant and so couldn't respond.

          I can guarantee you, the first doctor walking into my room waving a crucifix will be passed by me walking out of the room in my peek-a-boo gown, even if I have to drag an IV tree with me.

          Ted Cruz president? Pardon my Vietnamese, but Ngo Pho King Way.

          by ZedMont on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 04:33:42 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

        •  Unless you're a pregnant woman with complications (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          thanatokephaloides

          or anybody who wants contraception. "Minor" details like that.

  •  yabba Dabba doo doo (11+ / 0-)

    I want 1 less Tiny Coffin, Why Don't You? Support The President's Gun Violence Plan.

    by JML9999 on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 07:32:32 AM PDT

  •  Christianist madrassas (16+ / 0-)

    .... where the future of home-grown terrorism is born.

      •  Why the surprise (10+ / 0-)

        Insulate them from reality.

        Inculcate them with beliefs of justice in the afterlife.

        Drum dogma into them in place of education.

        Inevitable collision with reality = cognitive dissonance.

        Light a match.

        Step back.

        “With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.”
        ― Steven Weinberg
        •  Quite hilariously, from my point of view (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          JerryNA, thanatokephaloides

          Evangelistic Christian pollster Barna Group has noted in a study that young Evangelicals are fact-checking sermons on their smart phones.

          How Technology is Changing Millennial Faith

          The one-way communication from pulpit to pew is not how Millennials experience faith. By nature of digital connectedness, Millennial life is interactive. For many of them, faith is interactive as well—whether their churches are ready for it or not. It’s an ongoing conversation, and it’s all happening on their computers, tablets and smart phones. What’s more, many of them bring their devices with them to church. Now with the ability to fact-check at their fingertips, Millennials aren’t taking the teaching of faith leaders for granted. In fact, 14% of Millennials say they search to verify something a faith leader has said. A striking 38% of practicing Christian Millennials say the same.
          That correlates will with the fraction of young Evangelicals who get out entirely later on.

          Back off, man. I'm a logician.—GOPBusters™

          by Mokurai on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 10:39:29 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  Conceded that there is a difference between... (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Dave925, happymisanthropy, Shawn87

        ...what we think of a madrassas and US charter religious schools.

        But, that word has been appropriated for propaganda and may not mean what you think it means.

        Madrasa (Arabic: مدرسة‎, madrasah pl. مدارس, madāris) is the Arabic word for any type of educational institution, whether secular or religious (of any religion). Variously transliterations appear: madrasah, madarasaa, medresa, madrassa, madraza, medrese, etc. In the West, the word usually refers to a specific type of religious school or college for the study of the Islamic religion, though this may not be the only subject studied. As of 2004 20,000 madrasas educated over 1.5 million students per year.
        ------  from Wikipedia article

        However, I would say that the difference is of degree, not kind.

        •  As I'm sure you've surmised, I think there's quite (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Joe Bob, sajiocity

          a bit of difference. After the OKC bombing, some character in a cartoon said, "Timothy McVeigh was a Christian," causing me to say, "Oh, my God, what a clever and DEVASTATING rejoinder!" followed by "The next time some jihadi detonates himself, and takes the legs off your child, I hope you will remember your statement and not say a f___ing word."

          I bow to no one in my eye-rolling disgust for religious morons of any stripe, but I dare say there hasn't been a rash of attacks by people who think evolution's just a theory. Speaking of which, I'm quite surprised at the way Dr. Tyson has made no bones about such things in the new "Cosmos."

          •  There are Christianist Jihads as well (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            JerryNA, thanatokephaloides
            United States
            Murders

            In the U.S., violence directed towards abortion providers has killed at least eight people, including four doctors, two clinic employees, a security guard, and a clinic escort.[8][9]

                March 10, 1993: Dr. David Gunn of Pensacola, Florida was fatally shot during a protest. He had been the subject of wanted-style posters distributed by Operation Rescue in the summer of 1992. Michael F. Griffin was found guilty of Gunn's murder and was sentenced to life in prison.
                July 29, 1994: Dr. John Britton and James Barrett, a clinic escort, were both shot to death outside another facility, the Ladies Center, in Pensacola. Rev. Paul Jennings Hill was charged with the killings. Hill received a death sentence and was executed on September 3, 2003. The clinic in Pensacola had been bombed before in 1984 and was also bombed subsequently in 2012.
                December 30, 1994: Two receptionists, Shannon Lowney and Lee Ann Nichols, were killed in two clinic attacks in Brookline, Massachusetts. John Salvi was arrested and confessed to the killings. He died in prison and guards found his body under his bed with a plastic garbage bag tied around his head. Salvi had also confessed to a non-lethal attack in Norfolk, Virginia days before the Brookline killings.
                January 29, 1998: Robert Sanderson, an off-duty police officer who worked as a security guard at an abortion clinic in Birmingham, Alabama, was killed when his workplace was bombed. Eric Robert Rudolph, who was also responsible for the 1996 Centennial Olympic Park bombing, was charged with the crime and received two life sentences as a result.
                October 23, 1998: Dr. Barnett Slepian was shot to death with a high-powered rifle at his home in Amherst, New York.[10] His was the last in a series of similar shootings against providers in Canada and northern New York state which were all likely committed by James Kopp. Kopp was convicted of Slepian's murder after being apprehended in France in 2001.

                May 31, 2009: Dr. George Tiller was shot and killed by Scott Roeder as Tiller served as an usher at a church in Wichita, Kansas.[11]

            Attempted murder, assault, and kidnapping

            According to statistics gathered by the National Abortion Federation (NAF), an organization of abortion providers, since 1977 in the United States and Canada, there have been 17 attempted murders, 383 death threats, 153 incidents of assault or battery, and 3 kidnappings committed against abortion providers.[12] Attempted murders in the U.S. included:[8][13][14]

                August 19, 1993: Dr. George Tiller was shot outside of an abortion facility in Wichita, Kansas. Shelley Shannon was charged with the crime and received an 11-year prison sentence (20 years were later added for arson and acid attacks on clinics).
                July 29, 1994: June Barret was shot in the same attack which claimed the lives of James Barrett, her husband, and Dr. John Britton.
                December 30, 1994: Five individuals were wounded in the shootings which killed Shannon Lowney and Lee Ann Nichols.
                October 28, 1997: Dr. David Gandell of Rochester, New York was injured by flying glass when a shot was fired through the window of his home.[15]
                January 29, 1998: Emily Lyons, a nurse, was severely injured, and lost an eye, in the bombing which also killed Robert Sanderson.

            Arson, bombing, and property crime

            According to NAF, since 1977 in the United States and Canada, property crimes committed against abortion providers have included 41 bombings, 173 arsons, 91 attempted bombings or arsons, 619 bomb threats, 1630 incidents of trespassing, 1264 incidents of vandalism, and 100 attacks with butyric acid ("stink bombs").[12] The New York Times also cites over one hundred clinic bombings and incidents of arson, over three hundred invasions, and over four hundred incidents of vandalism between 1978 and 1993.[16] The first clinic arson occurred in Oregon in March 1976 and the first bombing occurred in February 1978 in Ohio.[17] Incidents have included:

                December 25, 1984: An abortion clinic and two physicians' offices in Pensacola, Florida, were bombed in the early morning of Christmas Day by a quartet of young people (Matt Goldsby, Jimmy Simmons, Kathy Simmons, Kaye Wiggins) who later called the bombings "a gift to Jesus on his birthday."[18][19][20] The clinic, the Ladies Center, would later be the site of the murder of Dr. John Britton and James Barrett in 1994 and a firebombing in 2012.
                March 29, 1993: Blue Mountain Clinic in Missoula, Montana; at around 1 a.m., an arsonist snuck onto the premises and firebombed the clinic. The perpetrator, a Washington man, was ultimately caught, convicted and imprisoned. The facility was a near-total loss, but all of the patients' records, though damaged, survived the fire in metal file cabinets.[21][22][23]
                May 21, 1998: Three people were injured when acid was poured at the entrances of five abortion clinics in Miami, Florida.[24]
                October 1999: Martin Uphoff set fire to a Planned Parenthood clinic in Sioux Falls, South Dakota, causing US$100 worth of damage. He was later sentenced to 60 months in prison.[25]
                May 28, 2000: An arson at a clinic in Concord, New Hampshire, resulted in several thousand dollars' worth of damage. The case remains unsolved.[26][27][28] This was the second arson at the clinic.[29]
                September 30, 2000: John Earl, a Catholic priest, drove his car into the Northern Illinois Health Clinic after learning that the FDA had approved the drug RU-486. He pulled out an ax before being forced to the ground by the owner of the building, who fired two warning shots from a shotgun.[30]
                June 11, 2001: An unsolved bombing at a clinic in Tacoma, Washington, destroyed a wall, resulting in $6,000 in damages.[25][31]
                July 4, 2005: A clinic Palm Beach, Florida, was the target of an arson. The case remains open.[25]
                December 12, 2005: Patricia Hughes and Jeremy Dunahoe threw a Molotov cocktail at a clinic in Shreveport, Louisiana. The device missed the building and no damage was caused. In August 2006, Hughes was sentenced to six years in prison, and Dunahoe to one year. Hughes claimed the bomb was a "memorial lamp" for an abortion she had had there.[32]
                September 11, 2006 David McMenemy of Rochester Hills, Michigan, crashed his car into the Edgerton Women's Care Center in Davenport, Iowa. He then doused the lobby in gasoline and started a fire. McMenemy committed these acts in the belief that the center was performing abortions; however, Edgerton is not an abortion clinic.[33] Time magazine listed the incident in a "Top 10 Inept Terrorist Plots" list.[34]
                April 25, 2007: A package left at a women's health clinic in Austin, Texas, contained an explosive device capable of inflicting serious injury or death. A bomb squad detonated the device after evacuating the building. Paul Ross Evans (who had a criminal record for armed robbery and theft) was found guilty of the crime.[35]
                May 9, 2007: An unidentified person deliberately set fire to a Planned Parenthood clinic in Virginia Beach, Virginia.[36]
                December 6, 2007: Chad Altman and Sergio Baca were arrested for the arson of Dr. Curtis Boyd's clinic in Albuquerque. Baca's girlfriend had scheduled an appointment for an abortion at the clinic.[37][38]
                January 22, 2009 Matthew L. Derosia, 32, who was reported to have had a history of mental illness[39] rammed an SUV into the front entrance of a Planned Parenthood clinic in St. Paul, Minnesota.[40]
                January 1, 2012 Bobby Joe Rogers, 41, firebombed the American Family Planning Clinic in Pensacola, Florida, with a Molotov cocktail; the fire gutted the building. Rogers told investigators that he was motivated to commit the crime by his opposition to abortion, and that what more directly prompted the act was seeing a patient enter the clinic during one of the frequent anti-abortion protests there. The clinic had previously been bombed at Christmas in 1984 and was the site of the murder of Dr. John Britton and James Barrett in 1994.[41]
                April 1, 2012 A bomb exploded on the windowsill of a Planned Parenthood clinic in Grand Chute, Wisconsin, resulting in a fire that damaged one of the clinic's examination rooms. No injuries were reported.
                April 11, 2013 A Planned Parenthood clinic in Bloomington, Indiana, was vandalized with an axe.[42]

            from: Wikipedia article on Anti-abortion violence
        •  Teaching Hospitals (0+ / 0-)

          are what RLegault was referring to, not charter schools!

      •  Tennessee church killer, (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        thanatokephaloides

        Dr. Tiller's murderer and the one who attempted but failed to carry out mass slaughter at the Tides Foundation all "Christians."

        Also the many terroristic letter writers, sign posters and clinic bombers.

        Reaganomics noun pl: blind faith that unregulated capitalism can provide unlimited goods for unlimited people on a planet with finite resources. Synonyms: trickle-down; voodoo economics. Antonyms: common sense. Related Words: Laffer curve.

        by FrY10cK on Tue Mar 25, 2014 at 07:49:40 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  And the kids who attend these "academies" or the (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      page394

      home schooled crowd will have trouble getting a job in the real world with the lack of all types of knowledge necessary to hold a technical or even management job in today's economy.

      And it feels like I'm livin'in the wasteland of the free ~ Iris DeMent, 1996

      by MrJersey on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 08:34:31 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Maybe not true - (9+ / 0-)

        In places outside cities especially in the South and midwest everyone knows what church you attend and how regularly you attend, and if you do fellowship (handing out with otherlike minded religious folk).  Look at Hobby Lobby  - John's Pizza, tons of companies that push a religious agenda on their employees because the Supreme Court of Morons has basically trhrown their hands up and refuse to get involved.  

        And when they interview you it goes like this:them-  "what church do you attend?"   you- "It's not legal to ask that question" them- "well you can answer and move on to the next phase of the interview or not answer in which case the interview is over".  They learned this tactic from foreign companies - like the Swiss - who asked none of your busienss questions and if you wouldn't answer they terminated the interview.  Which puts you in the position of being forced to lie to get a job.  How Christian.

        UGH, TEXAS. Please secede!

        by u028021 on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 09:43:39 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  From a Secular Homeschooler in a Saturated Red (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Bronx59, FiredUpInCA, JerryNA

          State that runs just like that--THANK YOU u028021 In some places the mentality we worry about, has already saturated the public school system.

          "It were a thousand times better for the land if all Witches, but especially the blessing Witch, might suffer death." qtd by Ehrenreich & English. For Her Own Good, Two Centuries of Expert's Advice to Women pp 40

          by GreenMother on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 11:34:07 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

      •  There is the technical side (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        ebohlman, FiredUpInCA, JerryNA, MrJersey

        but what of the social side? As in social skills that are being taught to these impressionable young minds.

        My guess is they are not being taught much in the way of tolerance and understanding and how to work with people.

        I can imagine that by the time they reach adulthood they will be incapable of working and operating with people. They will have to be re-educated so to speak if they hope to be employable.

        "We can either have democracy in this country or we can have great wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both." Louis Brandeis

        by wxorknot on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 01:01:43 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  I have nothing against (22+ / 0-)

    ... primitive superstitious cults, nor anyone who actually believes Jesus rode around on a dinosaur. But when they inflict their madness on me or my country...I stand with Thomas Jefferson and our founding fathers.

    "Do you realize that fluoridation is the most monstrously conceived and dangerous Communist plot we have ever had to face?" - General Jack D. Ripper

    by wilder5121 on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 07:38:01 AM PDT

  •  I dont blame Jesus for any of this (8+ / 0-)

    Every religion (and secular humanism too) seems overburdened with flaming morons these days.

  •  What kind of dino would Jesus ride? n/t (8+ / 0-)

    I'm not always political, but when I am I vote Democratic. Stay Democratic, my friends. -The Most Interesting Man in the World

    by boran2 on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 07:43:58 AM PDT

  •  I would suggest that vanity was thinking that (12+ / 0-)

    of the 33,000 religions in the world only mine is correct and only I am God's voice on earth.  Our Founders looked at religion and agreed with Jefferson from the Virginia Act of Religious freedom.

    Sorry, block quotes was not available

    Well aware that Almighty God hath created the mind free; that all attempts to influence it by temporal punishments or burdens, or by civil incapacitations, tend only to beget habits of hypocrisy and meanness, and are a departure from the plan of the Holy Author of our religion, who being Lord both of body and mind, yet chose not to propagate it by coercions on either, as was in his Almighty power to do; that the impious presumption of legislators and rulers, civil as well as ecclesiastical, who, being themselves but fallible and uninspired men, have assumed dominion over the faith of others, setting up their own opinions and modes of thinking as the only true and infallible, and as such endeavoring to impose them on others, hath established and maintained false religions over the greatest part of the world, and through all time; that to compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves, is sinful and tyrannical; that even the forcing him to support this or that teacher of his own religious persuasion, is depriving him of the comfortable liberty of giving his contributions to the particular pastor whose morals he would make his pattern, and whose powers he feels most persuasive to righteousness, and is withdrawing from the ministry those temporal rewards, which proceeding from an approbation of their personal conduct, are an additional incitement to earnest and unremitting labors for the instruction of mankind; that our civil rights have no dependence on our religious opinions, more than our opinions in physics or geometry

    Never promote men who seek after a state-established religion; it is spiritual tyranny--the worst of despotism. It is turnpiking the way to heaven by human law, in order to establish ministerial gates to collect toll. John Leland

    by J Edward on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 07:44:01 AM PDT

    •  Echoes my first thought on reading this (12+ / 0-)

      Wait a second?  The idea that humans evolved from primates is "vain"?  But the idea that humans are the most favored and perfect creation in the entire universe of billions of stars in billions of galaxies is not?

      If You're A Republican, Corporations are people. Social Security and Medicare recipients are not.

      by FritzV on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 08:33:37 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  The root of Rovian Projection (0+ / 0-)

        "It were a thousand times better for the land if all Witches, but especially the blessing Witch, might suffer death." qtd by Ehrenreich & English. For Her Own Good, Two Centuries of Expert's Advice to Women pp 40

        by GreenMother on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 11:35:00 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  Two meanings for "vain" ... (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Shawn87, JerryNA

      1)  Arrogant
      2)  Futile

      either fits into "vanity, vanity, all is Vanity" ...

      But as a put-down of consideration of the Natural Selection mechanism in Darwinian Evolutionary Theory ...

      Well ...  a lot has been discovered and written about evolutionary mechanisms since 1859 ...  (Victoria was still Queen,  Lincoln was not yet President, and Christian Science was getting better outcomes than medical doctors in hospitals)  

      A century and a half later We no longer take  "Darwin" as the Alpha and Omega of biology just as we no longer take Koch's Postulates as much more than a revered ancestor of  what would become contemporary thought about pathogens.

      So yeah ... had Evolutionists(tm) taken after their Religionist neighbors' thought habits of assuming  "The Oldest Source is the Best Source"... then yes, consideration of Natural Selection WOULD have been "vain" ... though  "wicked" is pretty much a partisan and sectarian judgement.

      But ... that's not how science works or how scientists think.   And that's not what happened.

      •  Teaching humans that they have some special-er (0+ / 0-)

        purpose to serve in this world, to the point that it's okay to cause the 6th Mass Extinction event is pretty futile. I mean it won't help our survival as a species either.

        "It were a thousand times better for the land if all Witches, but especially the blessing Witch, might suffer death." qtd by Ehrenreich & English. For Her Own Good, Two Centuries of Expert's Advice to Women pp 40

        by GreenMother on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 11:36:35 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Every gooper running for office this year should (13+ / 0-)

    be asked if they condone this.

  •  The last thing I heard about E. Warren (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Dave925, Joe Bob

    I am against vouchers.  I am against charter schools.  I am for a school district having the freedom to innovate new schools, and that they are also encouraged to innovate new educational approaches.

    The last I read, however, about Elizabeth Warren's position on vouchers is that she is in favor of them.

    This is something on which not all liberals and progressives agree.  I think there is ample evidence to demonstrate that neither of these things will solve the problems in schools.  

    Streichholzschächtelchen

    by otto on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 07:48:41 AM PDT

    •  School Vouchers are favored by Catholics (5+ / 0-)

      And in MA there is a Catholic school in every town.  

      •  Of course ... (5+ / 0-)

        The Catholic Community USED to support it's own schools with voluntary contributions from their parishes as a whole, as well as by tuition paid by parents.

        They were able to keep costs down by self-qualifying their Teaching Sisters, who were a good deal less expensive than unionized lay teachers.

        But now ... Community support for Catholic Schools increasingly consists  of advocating for the diversion of public money to private and parochial schools in general

        Something the Chabad/Lubovich "Haredi" have exploited to THEIR parochial benefit.

        •  Over the years, since the Roman religion held its (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          JerryNA

          2nd Vatican Synod, the supply of constipated and menopausal old maids has tended to dry up; and the "three hots and a cot in a cell" life-style is no longer all that attractive to both genders - or sexes, if you prefer.

          Meanwhile, the cost of maintaining buildings has continued to spiral upward; and the income of the average parent has not.  So, the one-time edifice complex of parochial schools has become more of a surplus drug on the market of abandoned junk-piles, awaiting "development into condominiums".

          And then too, that "self-qualification" of such "Teaching Sisters" as were themselves little more than cooks, dishwashers, seamstresses, and other menial - and not necessarily very educated, if educated at all - members of their nunnery, has had to give way to the reality of State Certification, Accreditation by College level Associations, and Continuing Education requirements.

          Grabbing a chunk of tax monies really hasn't improved the matter all that much.  Nor, in the end, will such tactics really ever improve a decayed and swinish system of mere indoctrination, rote memorization of senseless and meaningless jargon, AND, of course, football teams, and such like, to ensure the continued existence of such "Universities" as Notre Dame.

  •  My poor brain is getting twisted up. (21+ / 0-)

    Here goes. If you privatize education, and you then spend much time teaching that the bible is fact, and science is fiction, you are intentionally creating a huge downgrade in America's ability to compete with the rest of the world, are you not? And, sure, you don't reach every child, but you get a percentage that is significant, and grows.

    Whether it works or not(and we better hope it's NOT) it strikes me that these people are intentionally sabotaging the structure of our country, and aiming to make us a third world hell-hole populated by ignorant, faith-dominated peasants.

    So either I'm crazy, or they are. Well, it could be both, but I'm just saying....

    •  There's a reason (16+ / 0-)

      they get called the American Taliban, and you've just articulated it.

      "Education is the key to unlock the golden door of freedom." -- G.W.Carver

      by northbronx on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 08:15:26 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  cheap labor (16+ / 0-)

      In my opinion, virtually the sum total of conservative goals and ideology is geared toward the creation of cheap labor.

      Strangling education funding/teaching crap produces under/dyseducated adults -> cheap, compliant labor

      Reproduction control yields families/women/children in poverty -> cheap, compliant labor

      Min. wage suppression -> ipso facto

      Shifting tax burden to lower income brackets further reduces available personal capital -> cheap, compliant labor

      Opposition to corp/industry/market regulations reduces livability, safety, health and bolstering fear of job loss -> cheap, compliant labor

      Opposition to universal health care -> cheap, compliant labor

      Warmongering serves to increase/maintain the MIC, starving domestic spending -> cheap, compliant labor

      Gutting SS and Medicare drives seniors back into labor market -> cheap, compliant labor

      Tired now.

      •  Absolutely Correct (5+ / 0-)

        And perfect examples of why anyone in the 99% is voting against their interests when they vote Greedy Old Phuckers.

        "My one hobby is maintaining a Democracy. If you get these 500,000 soldiers advocating anything smelling of Fascism, I am going to get 500,000 more and lick the hell out of you and we'll have a real war right here at home. - General Smedley Butler, 1933

        by Dave925 on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 09:57:22 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

    •  America's ability to compete ... (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Dave925, anon004, kfunk937

      Is not really going to suffer if there are pockets of culturally-mandated ignorance.

      The ignorant may suffer.

      But probably not ... one does not need to accept any particular theory of science to follow even intricate procedures in STEM and the medical industries.

      Personally, I don't mind if there are people "living in the hollers below god's line-of-sight" who keep their offspring ignorant and less-competitive.   More and better jobs for the children of "Brights", right ?

      On the other hand ... diverting tax money from public schools to religious academies.   I didn't care for it when the motive was racial segregation.  I don't care for it now when the motive is religious self-congratulation.

    •  Doesn't matter (4+ / 0-)

      if the Rapture is imminent, and the only thing that counts is making sure your kids are ready to go when the time comes. Which requires, as far as possible, not allowing them to be exposed to anything but the Biblical Worldview.

      The problem is that you can't raise children in that kind of bubble any more, and millions fall away every year. Those who remain are increasingly those who internalized the abuse.

      Back off, man. I'm a logician.—GOPBusters™

      by Mokurai on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 10:59:23 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  this is our fault, and nobody else's (12+ / 0-)

    Teaching creationism in public schools is illegal.  Period. In private schools, they can teach whatever horse shit they want, but in public schools, they can't. Creationists have lost every Federal court case they have ever been involved with, and there are over a dozen cases establishing that creationism is illegal to teach in a public school. Period. They simply have no defense.

    So if they are teaching it anyway, that is solely and only because our side has not sued the shit out of them for it.

    In the end, reality always wins.

    by Lenny Flank on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 07:52:46 AM PDT

    •  "Approved" non-public schools may have to (6+ / 0-)

      follow state curriculum guidelines and pass state tests. That's the case in Iowa, and only approved non-public schools get any state funding. Non-approved schools and home schoolers can "teach whatever horse shit they want."

      Generally, Catholic schools do not teach creationism. They include evolution as part of their biology curriculum.

    •  Nope (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      JerryNA, thanatokephaloides

      See my Diary from last year, The Constitution as Catch-22

      Short version: It doesn't matter what the law says if an entire society, or a controlling segment of a society, is determined to ignore it. As is the case in Red states with the Religious Right.

      We can sometimes stop them in the courts, or by electing saner members to school boards. Not always.

      Just like Freedom of Religion and Freedom of Speech in the Soviet Constitution, which applied only to the People, and "obviously" not to Enemies of the People. So if you were charged with a crime in a Soviet court, your lawyer risked getting sent to Siberia along with you if he tried to raise that Constitutional provision in your defense.

      Back off, man. I'm a logician.—GOPBusters™

      by Mokurai on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 11:04:44 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Wait, "modern math theorists"? Set theory? (7+ / 0-)

    Did some mathematical crackpot use creationism and homeschool textbooks as a vehicle to push his proof that pi is 3.2?  

    And then this:

    House Majority Leader Eric Cantor, for instance, is all about vouchers.
    So a dude named Cantor wants to give money to schools to deny set theory.  That's just so....well, oddly fitting.

    Taking jokes seriously is the exact mirror activity of laughing if someone says they have cancer. --jbou

    by Caj on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 07:53:25 AM PDT

    •  It’s even funnier than that. (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      dewtx, kfunk937

      From Wikipedia:

      To Cantor, his mathematical views were intrinsically linked to their philosophical and theological implications – he identified the Absolute Infinite with God, and he considered his work on transfinite numbers to have been directly communicated to him by God, who had chosen Cantor to reveal them to the world.
    •  Remember, Cantor's the one who will regularly (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      anon004, happymisanthropy, dewtx, kfunk937

      add the support of an entire 2 House Dems to all those House Republicans and call a thing "Bipartisan".

    •   There was a religious fight over calculus in the (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      kfunk937, kiri, JerryNA

      17th century. In the latest issue of Scientific American there is a short article called "The Secret Spiritual History of Calculus" based on a new book about the history of the origins of calculus by Amir Alexander coming out in April called "Infinitesimal: How a Dangerous Mathematical Theory Shaped the Modern World". The part excerpted in SA concerns a fight in the 17th century between the Jesuits, who believed that mathematics, especially geometry, should demonstrate the religious ideals of certainty, hierarchy, and order, with other religious orders who thought that mathematics should be used more inventively as a tool to learn more about the world. Remember this was during the time of Galileo when non-orthodox thinking could be dangerous. The bone of contention was whether a plane could be treated as an infinite number of lines, whether a solid could be treated as an infinite number of planes, and the nature of that infinity. The Jesuits contended that this line of mathematics defied standard geometry and so defied the absolute truth and authority of the church--but thankfully for us we know how that mathematical/religious argument turned out. Please read the short SA article to learn that arguments about math between religious authoritarians and the less-authoritarian adventurers goes back a long ways. I  am looking forward to reading this book when it comes out in April.

      But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, ... there are few die well that die in a battle; ... Now, if these men do not die well, it will be a black matter for the king that led them to it; — Shakespeare, ‘Henry V’

      by dewtx on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 10:17:24 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  So basically Fractals make them shit themselves (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        dewtx, kfunk937, page394

        initially?

        "It were a thousand times better for the land if all Witches, but especially the blessing Witch, might suffer death." qtd by Ehrenreich & English. For Her Own Good, Two Centuries of Expert's Advice to Women pp 40

        by GreenMother on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 11:38:19 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Undoubtedly! And Gödel's Theorems... (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          kfunk937, GreenMother

          will give them absolute fits. Imagine having arithmetical statements that are true but cannot be proved as being true. Like the Liar Paradox: "This statement is false." And that a mathematical theory that includes a statement of its own consistency is itself inconsistent. Fun, and mind-boggling, stuff!

          But if the cause be not good, the king himself hath a heavy reckoning to make, ... there are few die well that die in a battle; ... Now, if these men do not die well, it will be a black matter for the king that led them to it; — Shakespeare, ‘Henry V’

          by dewtx on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 12:08:00 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  One of us always tells the truth... (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            dewtx

            "It were a thousand times better for the land if all Witches, but especially the blessing Witch, might suffer death." qtd by Ehrenreich & English. For Her Own Good, Two Centuries of Expert's Advice to Women pp 40

            by GreenMother on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 02:54:03 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

          •  I apologize for being pedantic, but (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            dewtx
            Imagine having arithmetical statements that are true but cannot be proved as being true. Like the Liar Paradox: "This statement is false."
            The liar's paradox is not an arithmetical statement, nor is it true but unprovable.  The liar's paradox is an example of a statement that cannot be true or false.  Gödel's incompleteness theorem is based on a different paradoxical statement, not "this statement is false" but "this statement has no proof."

            In any case, neither fractals nor Gödel's self-referential arithmetic systems were around when theologians were freaking out about infinitesimals.

            Taking jokes seriously is the exact mirror activity of laughing if someone says they have cancer. --jbou

            by Caj on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 08:39:11 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

    •  As noted above, the article linked to (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      thanatokephaloides

      is explicitly labeled as satire.

      Back off, man. I'm a logician.—GOPBusters™

      by Mokurai on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 11:06:04 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Ironically evolution will sort this out for us (7+ / 0-)

    because children educated in this fashion will systematically and comprehensively underperform in later life as they will be fit for few careers and their educational credentials will be regarded very skeptically by employers and so forth.

    I think what is at issue here though is the whole notion of the rights of children versus their parents. But that is such a can of worms to get into.

    Remember to kick it over.

    by sprogga on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 07:53:56 AM PDT

  •  Electricity (5+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    GreenMother, dewtx, Dave925, JWR, Joe Bob

    Chemist by degree.  I found the chapters on electricity the most demanding in college (for me anyway).  I didn't do as well as I think I should in the subject, and even tried reading more about it after college while fascinated by it.

    To me, electricity is a lot of math but how can you explain it to creationists?  It's like water with a kick (voltage pressures and finding weakest resistances), but there's additional physics and math involved.  You can't tell students electricity is just as God wanted it.  A better religious analogy is Prometheus stealing fire if anything.

    Why does ice float but if you freeze anything else it sinks, according to Creationists?  I'd like to hear their answers.

    Faith Manages. -- J.M. Straczynski

    by Master Alchemi on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 08:02:14 AM PDT

  •  God took one look at Adam's penis and said, ... (9+ / 0-)

    "Sorry, Man, let me help you out with that. Go ahead, pull my finger."

    Comedy was created 5000 years ago at the expense of all mankind.


    A mirror is facial recognition hardware. Your narcissism is the software.

    by glb3 on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 08:12:33 AM PDT

  •  I hate charter schools (8+ / 0-)

    I mean, they're great if you have a caste system.

    But, we don't; we supposedly have an educated democracy.

    Supposedly.

    "People should not be afraid of their government; governments should be afraid of their people." --V

    by MikeTheLiberal on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 08:27:48 AM PDT

  •  Vain?!? This is what's vain: (8+ / 0-)

    "God created man in His own Image."

    Or, "faith's" previous claim: "Earth is the center of the universe."

    Evolution theory is the opposite of vain.

    •  Why is the statement concerning God creating (0+ / 0-)

      man in His (God's) own Image and Likeness "vain"?

      Is that because it issues MAN the challenge to grow, expand, and perhaps someday, recognize himself as having God-like potentials?  Might it not be a fact that evolution is more in keeping with that premise as REALITY than currently misunderstood , or mis proclaimed, to be?

      As to "flat earth", how about the actual stage of cultural and scientific development, when that was first proposed, and for millennia thereafter - until the technological ability to grind lenses, and manufacture such as telescopes, was developed?  Or are you saying that cultures do not evolve, though mankind, as an entity separate from culture, did?

  •  Except for the book they use, (4+ / 0-)

    Christian madrassas are no different from any other madrassa.

    The most violent element in society is ignorance.

    by Mr MadAsHell on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 08:34:04 AM PDT

  •  Not much fun to make fun (4+ / 0-)

    I don't find it that fun to make fun of the religious wackos.  Actually, it use to be funny.

    But, now this idiocy has infected our country in horrible ways and there are no signs it is going away in the near term.

    Can't wait until climate change drowns them along with their daddy will save me mythology.

    President Obama needs to be more liberal.

    by jimgilliamv2 on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 08:40:22 AM PDT

  •  More about evolution (9+ / 0-)

    I just posted a related essay:

    Evolution Before Charles Darwin

    In July, 1858, the Linnean Society gathered at its new headquarters in London to hear two papers by Charles Darwin and Alfred Russel Wallace in which they jointed announced a theory of evolution by natural selection. One of the many common misconceptions about biological evolution is that this was an idea first proposed by Charles Darwin. In reality, a number of scientists and natural philosophers had already written about this concept prior to Darwin.
    Too often those opposing evolution has little idea of what it really is nor do they have any idea of the history of this scientific concept.
    •  Yes. Darwin did not invent evolution. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      thanatokephaloides

      He came up with the beginnings of the explanation, through Natural Selection and Selection in Relation to Sex. It is one of the great sadnesses in the history of science that he never opened and read Mendel's first paper on genetics, even though he received a copy.

      Evolution is, to begin with, a coherent set of facts, not a theory. The additional facts of molecular biology give it a secure, though not by any means complete, theoretical foundation. It is the nature of scientific theory not to be complete. We are certainly not done with the Theory of General Relativity or Quantum Mechanics yet.

      Real religion is also radically incomplete. It is the height of hubris for humans to suppose that they have received and understood a complete revelation of truth, and to thank God that they are not as other men, even as these abortionists and LGBTs, when Jesus said that one who prays, "God be merciful to me, a sinner," will go home justified rather than the other.

      Back off, man. I'm a logician.—GOPBusters™

      by Mokurai on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 11:22:14 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Vouchers should be subject to oversight. (6+ / 0-)

    They should not come close to violating the separation of church and state, let alone teaching creationism.

  •  Vain? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    happymisanthropy

    If teaching people that human beings were created in the very image of GAWD himself isn't vanity, I don't know what is.

    "Give to every other human being every right that you claim for yourself." - Robert G. Ingersoll

    by Apost8 on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 10:04:12 AM PDT

  •  What could be more 'wicked and vain'... (3+ / 0-)

    ...than presuming humans look just like the only omnipotent deity in all the universe, and that entire universe itself was created for no other purpose than to give a home for these humans?

    Talk about pride and vanity!

    "Don't ride in anything with a Capissen 38 engine. They fall right out of the sky." -- Kaywinnit Lee Frye

    by Technowitch on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 10:04:54 AM PDT

    •  Who is "presuming humans look just like the only (0+ / 0-)

      omnipotent deity in all the universe, etc., etc."

      The words, "image and likeness," are 16th Century English translations of Koine-Greek translations of Ancient Hebrew-Aramaic constructs; which, themselves, appear to have been borrowed from an even more ancient culture, during the compilation of that part of Hebrew Mythology transcribed in the Genesis portion of the Pentateuch.

      Neither "pride" nor "vanity" had anything to do with them, at the time.  They have remained the most well known English descriptives, perhaps; but that does not have anything to do with "look-alike", in the superficial sense of outward appearance.  The basic implication is, that which we apprehend as "omnipotent deity" bestowed upon mankind - humanity - a "resemblance" that goes beyond the mortal shell.  Call that, "spirit", "soul", or even "sapience", "wisdom", "knowledge", "self-apprehension" - all words that are used to describe a particular difference between humans and other mammalian animals.

      And, as to the matter of ". . .entire universe created to give a home . . .", that too is not a part of the original concept; although extension of apprehension and perception might lead to the idea, according to the peculiarities of both cultural development and ability to extrapolate from experiences, events, and the ability to apprehend itself.

      Equating 16th Century language with 21st Century usage may appear to be a statement of a profundity, or a critique thereof.  In reality, it very rarely reaches that level.

  •  Doesn't Add Up (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    belinda ridgewood, page394, JerryNA

    I really have never understood the idea that the Bible should be taught as a literal text but if and only if those teachings are convenient and comply with the needs of the people at the time.

    •  Might this be true simply because the Bible IS NOT (0+ / 0-)

      a "literal text" to begin with?  Nor is it considered to be such, outside the limitations of a certain kind of what is called to day, "fundamentalist mind-set".  

      Generally speaking, those manuscripts that became permanently enrolled in the Canon of what is called the "New Testament", were - and for the most part still are - considered to be "accurate portrayals of historical events" - to somewhat oversimplify the "credentials" of the works.  The manuscripts making up the Greek Septuagint version of the Hebrew Mythology - or "Old Testament" - were included on the basis of their "prefiguration" of Christ, and subsequent Christianity.  The manuscript known as "Revelations", or "The Apocalypse", was admitted to the Canon by one (1) vote; and that mostly by way of its being attributed to the authorship of the "Beloved Disciple, John", written during his final years in exile on the Island of Patmos.

      Literality, other than in the specific area of Christianity, and parts of Christian Faith, is the outcome of the Protestant Revolution.  Having thrown out the real fundamentals of Christianity as such, the Revolutionaries - or "Reformers" as they called themselves - were left with . . . a "book"; a "book" from which has evolved the notion that it includes everything else pertaining to human knowledge, science, politics, economics . . .you name it, it's "in the book". . .somewhere.

      Of course, such an approach leads to the basic contradictions of "time and place", among many others.  And, squabbles over such as "eating shellfish", and/or a "flat earth", are merely logical outcomes of attempting to make "literal" something that is, largely, metaphorical in content outside of the specific areas of "religion", or "belief".

      If one wants to believe in a "flat earth", such belief is guaranteed - by way of the 1st Amendment to the Constitution - to be free of any form of both governmental interference and governmental elevation into "establishment", while also being guaranteed the right of "free exercise" - i.e., preaching, teaching, writing, etc., - on the part of the believer.  What IS NOT GUARANTEED however, is any right to insist that "flat earth" be shoved down everyone else's throat.

      So much for "convenient", and compliance "with the needs of the people at the time."

    •  Thanks for your first comment, nejackso. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      thanatokephaloides

      I'm with you -- the Bible is chock-full of pronouncements about which any given group of fundamentalists is mysteriously silent.

      Welcome from the DK Partners & Mentors Team. If you have any questions about how to participate here, you can learn more at the Knowledge Base or from the New Diarists Resources Diaries. Diaries labeled "Open Thread" are also great places to ask. We look forward to your contributions.


      Shop Kos Katalogue ❧ Help Okiciyap at Cheyenne River reservation.

      by belinda ridgewood on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 10:10:49 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Okay.. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    JerryNA

    .. so now these people are complaining about science because it contains no Scientific Laws regarding evolution? Wow, that's like moving the goalposts to somewhere approaching infinity, which I suppose was the desired effect. These people must get the nail-biting shivers whenever faced with something as terrifying as the real world.

    CBS: It's the new Fox!

    by JWR on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 10:07:25 AM PDT

  •  I say just take their money (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    devis1

    So they can populate the earth, but do some good with it.
    seems to me they love sex so start xtianf**kbuddies dot com.

    Because you can always be forgiven AFTER you get laid.

  •  Scopes and the Radical Right (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    dewtx, kfunk937, JerryNA

    An epitome of Clarence Darrow's publicity stunts in the Scopes trial (1925) is his claim, while questioning his opponent in the trial, William Jennings Bryan, that: "We have the purpose of preventing bigots and ignoramuses from controlling the education of the United States."

    Over the telegraph wires, Darrow won his case in the court of public opinion. Yet Scopes was convicted of violating Tennesee's Butler Act that forbade the teaching of evolution in public schools. And the trial inspired other states to pursue Bulter-like laws.

    As always, 90 years after Scopes, the anti-evolutionists are bigots and no-knowings (if not ignoramuses). But the corporate feudalists, wanting US education as market territory and advertising leverage, are the real radicals and in my opinion traitors of a functioning US republic; by undermining public education they would take hostage the possibility of critical thinking among those not born with the wealth to buy a good private education. And if they succeed, then the already-beggared public school systems, cynically set-up for increasing failure along with the dispirited learning instituted by No Child Left Behind, would go the next step in turning non-wealthy US citizens into ignorant peons. Neo-feudalists need thinking citizens like they need a well-oiled guillotine in front of the Washington Monument.

  •  Flawed math that put a man on the moon. (5+ / 0-)

    Made a hydrogen bomb explode.
    A cell phone work.

    Let's see them work their hocus-pocus.
    Put up or shut up.

    You can't make this stuff up.

    by David54 on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 10:44:15 AM PDT

  •  "Wicked and vain" sounds like the Amish! (0+ / 0-)

    Might as well just have Sharia Law.

    Please know I am not rude. I cannot rec anything from this browser. When I rec or post diaries I am a guest at some exotic locale's computer. Ayn is the bane!

    by Floyd Blue on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 11:13:24 AM PDT

  •  Wrapped in a Flag (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    raptavio, JerryNA

    And Carrying a Cross!!!

  •  Why Set Theory? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    dewtx

    Thanks for this diary, as I think it draws attention to the problem.  However I'd like to add some commentary, if I may, to elaborate just what it is that fundams have against "set theory" mathematics -- and it's much more than just "it ain't in the Bible so I don't believe it"!  I've posted a diary with my own comments on why set theory in particular is threatening to the "respectable intellectual vanguard" of the Christian apologetics movement, said movement I feel to be far more dangerous than the garden variety of grifters and yokels such as Ken Ham and Ray Comfort.  The modern apologetics movement strives to put a smart-sounding intellectual veneer on old ideas, making them more respectable to people who are educated (but not quite educated enough to see their flaws).  And it is for this reason that concepts like set theory need to be suppressed among the hoi-polloi: if more of the general public understood them, then they wouldn't be as susceptible to the smart-sounding chicanery of guys like William Lane Craig.

    ----------------------- "Zu jeder Zeit, an jedem Ort, bleibt das Tun der Menschen das gleiche..."

    by Rheinhard on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 01:11:32 PM PDT

  •  first a religion, now, an education system (0+ / 0-)

    based on the "FLINSTONES" ?

  •  No offense intended (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    dewtx, JerryNA

    However some people are always going to be offended, no matter what you say or how you say it. Good morning has been a prelude to an argument bordering on the hostile - so my lesson is learned.
    While I TRY to respect anyone's right to believe what they want, just as I TRY to respect the right to free speech, I have serious reservations when those beliefs are far out of touch with the facts of life and the Universe that we live in, just as I have reservations about people who yell 'fire' in a crowded theater... and when whimsical 'beliefs' founded on nothing other than wishful thinking and 'ancestral traditions' cause damage in real time, real life by leading to false 'truths' that are the basis and foundation for erroneous and damaging decisions, legislation and actions - such reservations should be adequately aired and dealt with in a sane forum.
    Those who CHOOSE to deny factual evidence and the proof provided by the sciences have a very shaky claim to 'faith' anyhow. If indeed, God did 'speak' the Universe into being, then the Universe, everything in it, MUST be the product of Gods word... God's TRUE word... and every fact we can find and prove about the Universe, and the nature thereof, MUST be God's true word as well.
    There can be NO actual conflict between Gods True word and the facts provided by Sciences. Where such a conflict exists, one or the other must be wrong, and we were 'given' the intelligence to weigh the evidence and find the truth.
    I have no proof that God exists... but then again I have no proof that God does NOT exist. The religions to date fail to prove God does exist, yet the sciences constantly provide us with facts and evidence that the Universe does exist.
    In short, to deny science is to deny the true word of God, and that God exists outside of a very old book, written and rewritten, revised, modified, altered and 'editorialized' by hundreds of years of  political motivations and corrupt rulers who benefited in too many ways by keeping the general population sedated, content, quiet and obedient under their rule.
    I would sooner invest in Animoil (see Farmed and Dangerous).

    •  "Free Speech" means people can say any stupid (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      thanatokephaloides

      (esp. religious) thing they want. It does not guarantee a publicly funded platform, nor does it guarantee credulity or freedom from argument and being mocked. The religious types complaints of "persecution" are garbage. They only invoke the Constitution when they can get something out of it, just like their selective Bible-quoting.

  •  This is nothing other than state-sanctioned and (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    JerryNA

    financed child abuse.  It might as well be administered to the rhythm of a shaman's rattle for all the scientific and mathematical value it provides.

    By paying for this with federal tax dollars, we have delivered Galileo back to the dungeon of ignorance and superstition.

    Ted Cruz president? Pardon my Vietnamese, but Ngo Pho King Way.

    by ZedMont on Mon Mar 24, 2014 at 04:21:52 PM PDT

  •  This is the last thing we need. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    JerryNA

    Another generation of idiots and racist. Haven't we had enough? Should we be forced to pay for this crap too?
    Our not VOTING, is the one thing the GOP count on to win.They can't win if we show up and vote them out. It should be a huge win for Democrat's...but only if we show up and vote them out once and for all.

  •  CALL ME CRAZY, BUT... (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    thanatokephaloides

    I'm one of those crazy Catholics who thinks religion and science CAN co-exist, somebody who firmly believes in Darwin's theory of evolution with a little bit of intelligent design thrown in. All that being said, the information provided in this diary is exactly why I'm against the increase in charter schools and the use of vouchers. If parents want to send their kids to a predominately religious school, then that's fine. However, the taxpayers shouldn't be forced to underwrite the costs for such private education in schools that not only teach creationism, they indoctrinate students into Christianity.

    The Constitution is pretty clear about the separation of church and state. Even though I'm a Christian, I wouldn't want to send my son to a religious school that denigrated evolution and other scientific and mathematical science, and I sure as hell don't want my tax dollars being spent on sending other people's kids to one. Even the Catholic schools aren't as bad about brainwashing students into creationism as the fundamental Christian schools. We need to do away with publicly-funded charter schools and vouchers altogether, because some of these schools' curricula are sending children the wrong message by denying them knowledge in the areas of math and science. Even worse, religious schools funded through vouchers are giving carte blanche to those on the Christian Right with their own agenda, sending the American education system down a very slippery slope away from scientific learning and straight into religious indoctrination.

    Personally, I'm getting pretty sick of the atheists who constantly rag on religious teachings, as well as the Christian fundamentalist nut jobs who discount science and evolution altogether. Still, publicly-funded schools should not be vilifying evolution and science and preaching religion and creationism.

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