I was unable to look at Daily Kos for a day or so. When I did look this morning, and read some replies to comments posted in This Diary - I was surprised, shocked, even dismayed by the flames.
Before I go change my sig line, give up participating in Occupy, and focus on other positive means of change - I would like to hear from the members of Daily Kos on the subject of violence at Occupies. I would like (but do not expect) to see an actual adult conversation about it. I would prefer, and hope that we can talk about it without personal insults (to anyone), and without broad generalizations about factions within the Occupy movement.
First - let me throw out some "Occupy Credentials", since it seems to be important to many people. I have been a member of this movement since the fourth day of its existence. I have marched, I have participated in many GA's, I have helped to feed many citizens at the Occupies, I have shouted my anger at TPTB, I have held signs, I have been photographed and quoted, and even been the subject of articles in foreign press. I have spent time with OO, OSF, and Occupy Sacramento. I am no stranger to West Oakland either.
And beyond the orange spaghetti monster -
I said in that Diary (linked above) that I and several other Occupy members in several cities and states have promoted the idea that those that would be violent, and those that would purposely offend the public in the area - are of little use to the movement as a whole, and should be corralled. Offending the cops? Offending the 1%? We can't help that. But, if we are to call ourselves the 99%, shouldn't we be thinking about the public we say we represent? Should the Larouchies be 'allowed' to parade around with their "Obama is a Nazi" signs at our rallies or marches? Should those that show up with the intent of "strategic, tactical violence" be 'allowed' to make this a bloody revolution?
It has been my thinking since the beginning - we are for these ideals:
(1) Getting money out of politics.
(2) Correcting the uneven distribution of wealth in America.
(3) Standing up for our Constitutional Rights.
(4) So many other reasons, I can't count them all.
What wasn't included in my own personal view of Occupy was the idea that we can create lasting change through violent tactics.
The results of comments in this Diary will tell me what my fellow Daily Kos members opinions on the subject happen to be. I'll start by saying that I now understand, from the comments in the Diary in question - that not all Anarchists are violent, or intend violence. In that respect, maybe I was using broad generalizations about them. My bad.
If the general consensus (here) is that using violence - strategic, tactical, or otherwise is okay with you - then I will change my focus to other positive venues to change. There is plenty to be done right here at the Kos to help create positive change. I cannot stand behind a movement that includes violence as an intended tool for such change.
My hope is that I can still count on Occupy to keep moving the American Conversation towards equality and respect of our Constitutional Rights.
So, is violence at Occupy okay with you, or not? My participation in it is now dependent on what my fellow Kossacks think about it. My level of loyalty to any group or cause goes in this order:
(1) Better Democrats (that actually vote the will of the People).
(2) Daily Kos
(3) Occupy.
If I have to go back to just the first two, I will.
So, again, let's have an adult conversation about this, leaving out the personal insults or smears. Let's also at least try to take a walk in the other person's shoes and not make generalizations (for which we have no proof) about any specific group of people.
Please, argue nicely and use your inside voices. Convince me.
Update: Thanks for all the comments. My questions have been answered by people I respect and trust here. I will continue my support for Occupy, with eyes wide open. Again, I was surprised by the level of anger, the rationalizations of violence, and even a personal insult directed at me for even writing the Diary. Nice.
I will stand against violence being perpetrated on my behalf. You want to throw a brick? You'll have to throw it at me first. It won't be the first time. Even the angriest here had valuable information to add. I got exactly what I asked for. There is still support for Occupy here from those who do not promote violence, and it brings me relief. I have come full circle back to the same ideas I had in the beginning - you can't judge the entire movement by the acts of a few individuals.
Thank you.