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This is why! Trigger Warning

Because this woman has no legal protections. If she went to the police she would be arrested. Actually from what I understand that happens here as well.

The Russian equivalent of Facebook lets that video stay up BTW.

Five against one. Sadly most bashings are numerically imbalanced.

This is a country that has set the Nazis loose on their own people.

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Comment Preferences

  •  Why is this even a debate? (9+ / 0-)

    The Olympics are being staged in a country that grants its citizens no rights. Are we really so wrapped up in sports that we are willing to support this?

    How hard is it really for us to simply not watch the events? How meaningful can gold medals really be?

    It is 2013, more than a decade into the 21st century and there are days when I feel we are going backward, not forward.

    "Pulling together is the aim of despotism and tyranny. Free men pull in all kinds of directions.” --Lord Vetinari

    by voracious on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 03:21:23 PM PDT

  •  It's also a perversion of it's original purpose (7+ / 0-)

    it's a corporate playground for the elites instead of a celebration of the human spirit.

    Obama: self-described Republican; backed up by right-wing policies

    by The Dead Man on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 03:26:43 PM PDT

    •  On a limited level I would agree but quick... (4+ / 0-)

      name three currrent figure skaters.  Name two skiers.  Name one bobsleder.  Tell me anything about curling.  Now how many foot ball players can you name?  Basketball players?  The Olyimpics pay off well for albut 1% of the athletes who compete in them--for teh other 99%, they are doing it for reasons other than money...and they deserve not to be fucked over for politics.

      "If Jesus had a gun he'd still be alive today." Homer Simpson, 2013

      by quiet in NC on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 04:01:46 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  Curling is (0+ / 0-)

        horizontal darts with a stone.
        What do I win?

        warning: snark above

        by NE2 on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 04:26:01 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Those athletes are not being (3+ / 0-)

        fucked over for politics. Human rights are not "politics". We have here a country that has singled out a minority population for punishment, brutality, and gawd knows what else. When do we make a stand? Do we wait until there are piles of bodies? Could that happen if this continues and there are no repercussions?

        If I were an athlete I wouldn't want the world to ignore what is happening in Russia so that I can compete. I couldn't live with that.

        "Humidity built the snowman. Sunshine brought him down" John Prine

        by high uintas on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 04:31:56 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Olympic names.... (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        quiet in NC, VClib, Actbriniel

        Johnny Weir (Ok, he's off and on lately), Mao Asada, Davis and White

        Lindsy Vonn and Ted Ligity

        I don't know a bobsledder by name, but I recognize them.

        Curling is played with brooms, and the object is to sweep the ice head of the little puck type thing and get it in the circle. There was a Simpson's episode about curling, btw.

        I don't know anything about 'popular' sports like foot ball and basketball. I do follow x games and 'alternative sports' :P.

        I also happen to agree with you. It's not about the sponsors, it's about the athletes who work hard to get there. And I hope Evan Lysachek beats that smug stuck up Russian figure skater on his own turf. (And I note that he was convinced after the last olympics that they would try to keep him out of Russia because he beat their guy fair and square last time.)

        "Madness! Total and complete madness! This never would've happened if the humans hadn't started fighting one another!" Londo Mollari

        by FloridaSNMOM on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 04:33:21 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  The last skiier I remember was.. Tomba (0+ / 0-)

        Curling is played with a rock and couple of brooms... probably invented by either insane canadians or scotsmen?

        Obama: self-described Republican; backed up by right-wing policies

        by The Dead Man on Mon Aug 19, 2013 at 11:19:48 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Agreed with Voracious (6+ / 0-)

    It's not a debate, I won't be watching the Olympics and won't allow any Olympic-themed television, products, or anything else in this household.

    If the IOC wants to play this game, forget 'em.  If Russia had done this with any other minority group, the furor would be deafening.  LGBT folks, not so much.

    Screw that.

    (-6.38, -7.03) Moderate left, moderate libertarian

    by Lonely Liberal in PA on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 03:28:10 PM PDT

    •  You won't need to turn on the TV. (0+ / 0-)

      We will have Olympics Liveblogs here again, and you can get your fill of Olympics updates here, where no one will even notice. Of course, if you aren't interested or if the boycott applies even here then you can just ignore the diaries.

  •  As bad as this is, it a cultural problem in Russia (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    FG, cbfromco, VClib, joe from Lowell

    and how that is going to be solved by an Olympic boycott is beyond me.  Should other countries boycott the US because of Tyvon Martin?  There are better ways.  

    This person got beat up--does that mean that years of training by hundreds of US athletes should be wasted?  That all other countries that do attend will have an asterisk on their metals saying "but the US did not compete"?  

    "If Jesus had a gun he'd still be alive today." Homer Simpson, 2013

    by quiet in NC on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 03:34:35 PM PDT

    •  First, I am in favor of the boycott (6+ / 0-)

      This is a line in the sand for me, Russia should not be allowed to showcase itself while this is going on. It's inhuman and inhumane and wrong on so many levels.

      On the Olympics, I saw them up close from beginning to end here in Utah. The whole shebang is about money, not just a few shekels but real 1% money. The athletes are an excuse and yes, there will be glory and gold for a few of them but the IOC could give a shit.

      They just want to get together and rub shoulders and make their deals. Why do you think Mittens was brought in here to cover up what goes on with every site that is chosen? He understands them.

      IMO, they should cancel and move it to Vancouver, they want it and can do it. I'm with George Takei.

      "Humidity built the snowman. Sunshine brought him down" John Prine

      by high uintas on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 03:56:52 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  A unilateral boycott would indeed be (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Horace Boothroyd III, Mannie

      useless. But there are other pathways that have a real shot at making Russia take notice, and there's no reason we can't lead the way (including by boycotting, as long as it's intended as a stepping stone to one of these):

      --A boycott of a large enough multilateral scale to render the games a political, financial, and cultural disaster.

      --The IOC moving the games to another country (thereby not hurting our athletes).

      --(My favorite solution): The IOC allowing the games to go on as planned, but ban Russian athletes from participation.

      Hope you fall on your burger and fries.

      by cardinal on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 04:23:14 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I get it--you care about LBGT rights... (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        doc2, VClib

        but what about the rights of the athletes--does any of that matter?  Boycott, boycott, boycott...sounds pretty simplistic and selfish to me.  Lobby the IOC to move the games--I'm fine with that.  Anything beyond that is incredibly futile.  Do you really think the Russian gay-bashers give two shits what the US thinks of them and will change their attitude overnight becuase we hurt their feelings?

        "If Jesus had a gun he'd still be alive today." Homer Simpson, 2013

        by quiet in NC on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 04:38:57 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  A few hundred athletes (3+ / 0-)

          can't be inconvenienced by something this major? What gives them such special privilege?

          No one makes a big fuss when political crises force cancellation of concert tours, scientific exchanges, foreign study opportunities, business trips, and tourism. To this day free travel to Cuba is prevented for political reasons. Lots of people have been asked to make sacrifices. Why can't a few hundred athletes?

          If you really think it's important to send a message to Moscow that homophobic pogroms are unacceptable to international civilized opinion, then it's important enough to require a few sacrifices. Switching from Stoli to Smirnoff doesn't impress me as a very significant sacrifice.

          •  Jessie Owens kicked Hitler's nuts. (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            VClib, happymisanthropy, Kickemout

            Be better...that is how you win.

            "If Jesus had a gun he'd still be alive today." Homer Simpson, 2013

            by quiet in NC on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 04:59:11 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  My bad... (0+ / 0-)

              Given the topic here, I suppose I picked a very in appropriate analogy above.  Sorry about that. But Jessie Owens did seriously embarrass old Adolph while the whole world was watching. Seventy-seven years later and everybody still knows about the incident--that says something.

              "If Jesus had a gun he'd still be alive today." Homer Simpson, 2013

              by quiet in NC on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 05:10:38 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Jesse Owens is a hero, but (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Horace Boothroyd III, Mannie

                he did not cause Hitler more than a moment's embarrassment. The 1936 Olympics in no way isolated or deterred Hitler. On the contrary-- two years later most of the West was still appeasing him at Munich, either because they underestimated him or because they actually preferred him as a counterweight to Stalin.

                The 1936 Olympics should have been boycotted.

                •  It's becoming quite clear. (2+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Horace Boothroyd III, Mannie

                  I thought I'd find more support here for treating the anti-homosexual laws in Russia as serious enough to warrant international outrage. But Americans just can't be convinced there is anything more important in the word than sports events.  

                  •  You are missing something... (1+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Actbriniel

                    the Olympics are a major souce of pride for a great many countries and their citizens.  You want to take that away.  I get it, in the US the olympics are too commercialized for your taste and you don't give a flying fuck about them--but that doesn't mean the same is true for every other country or every other person.  Excuse me for being truthful here, but about the stupidest thing I've heard in quite some time is your comment "the 1936 Olympics should have been boycotted".  Really?  Take away the pride every black person on the earth with access to a newspaper or radio felt that day?  Really?  People here are thinking with a single issue mind in a diverse and multifaceted world.

                    "If Jesus had a gun he'd still be alive today." Homer Simpson, 2013

                    by quiet in NC on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 07:57:57 PM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  I suggest you read the Wikipedia entry on (1+ / 0-)
                      Recommended by:
                      Mannie

                      the 1936 Berlin Olympics. They were shameful. German Jews were banned from competing (except for one politically selected token exception). The US rep fro the IOC, Avery Brundage, was a Nazi dupe who declared that all talk of boycotting was part of a "Jewish-Communist conspiracy." Most IOC bureaucrats were pro-Hitler and pro-Mussolini. Most American Jewish athletes boycotted anyway; there was much more talk in the US of boycotting than you would imagine. And the 1936 Olympics were indeed a propaganda triumph for Hitler: Leni Riefenstahl, director of "Triumph of the Will," made them the subject of another Nazi propaganda film.

                      Jesse Owens' victory was the only proud moment progressives could take away from the Olympics. But the notion that it had any major impact on Hitler is complete speculation; all we know is that Hitler refused to shake Jesse's hand. The fact that Nazi credibility wasn't at all damaged is shown by how Britain and France conducted themselves at Munich in 1938.

                      The Olympics are indeed a source of pride to nations-- particularly host nations. Hosting the Games provides despotic regimes the opportunity to display their power and gain international respectability. And that's why boycotting the Sochi Games is the single most effective protest the word could make against the new homophobic regime in Russia.  

        •  People say "boycott!" here in (0+ / 0-)

          reaction to most everything. If a bunch of people refuse to watch the Olympics on TV, it will accomplish nothing, for gay rights or anything else. Boycotts require hitting your counterparty in a very substantial economic way.

        •  That's why I (0+ / 0-)

          made three suggestions, none of which involve a unilateral boycott.

          Hope you fall on your burger and fries.

          by cardinal on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 05:28:26 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

  •  Go after corporate sponsors of the Olympics (8+ / 0-)

    Go after every last corporate sponsor and any corporation daft enough to sponsor the NBC televising of the Olympics.

    The IOC will change its toon quickly if we did that.

    You have to go after the money. We proved that with Limbaugh.

    John Roberts? Melville Fuller?? WTF is the difference???.

    by Walt starr on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 03:41:09 PM PDT

  •  Well, we did it in 1980 for a very good reason! (5+ / 0-)

    Russia had invaded Afghanistan and...

    oooh... yeah...  Ouch...

    Seriously though we should NOT go.

    No reason other than to make lots of money for corporate overlords.

    Dammit, now I KNOW we're going to go.  And it's just damn wrong.

    I don't blame Christians. I blame Stupid. Which sadly is a much more popular religion these days.

    by detroitmechworks on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 04:04:38 PM PDT

    •  Jessie Owens and 1936 (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      DefendOurConstitution

      There was time - and even consideration of moving the games in 1936.  Jessie Owens did his country and his people a great honor by performing so well and sticking it to the Nazis..

      And this is why:

      Soon after Hitler took power in 1933, observers in the United States and other western democracies questioned the morality of supporting Olympic Games hosted by the Nazi regime. Responding to reports of the persecution of Jewish athletes in 1933, Avery Brundage, president of the American Olympic Committee (AOC), stated: "The very foundation of the modern Olympic revival will be undermined if individual countries are allowed to restrict participation by reason of class, creed, or race." Brundage, like many others in the Olympic movement, initially considered moving the Games from Germany. After a brief and tightly managed inspection of German sports facilities in 1934, Brundage stated publicly that Jewish athletes were being treated fairly and that the Games should go on, as planned
      http://www.ushmm.org/...

      For a few weeks, the Germans treated Jews and African descendants seemingly fairly.. it didn't stop the horror that followed.

      No, I am not proposing that Russia will start a holocaust of gay individuals.   But what we learned from that event was that when there is no penalty, and only economic gain, we are wrong to further ideas that are counter to the fundamental ideas of the Olympics, and we will regret the longterm repercussions later.

      Gandhi's Seven Sins: Wealth without work; Pleasure without conscience; Knowledge without character; Commerce without morality; Science without humanity; Worship without sacrifice; Politics without principle

      by Chris Reeves on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 06:11:41 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  While I agree that the Russian position is (5+ / 0-)

    horrendous, I do not agree that a boycott of the Olympic games by the U.S. would accomplish anything.  The only people who would be hurt by that are the athletes.  I remember the 1980 boycott.  

    I agree with Greg Louganis.  Due to copyright issues, I won't quote the whole thing here, but it's worth a read.  Here's part:  

    Boycotting sends the wrong message and will only harm the hard-working athletes set to compete in the 2014 Olympics, not the Russian government itself. I know from personal experience. My first Olympics I won Silver at age 16, and then in 1980, at the height of my diving career, President Jimmy Carter opted to boycott the 1980 Olympics in Moscow as a method of protesting the Soviet invasion in Afghanistan. The toll on fellow athletes and me was devastating. We had trained our entire lives for that one moment. Fortunately, I was lucky enough to continue my diving career and return to compete and win two gold medals in the 1984 Olympics in Los Angeles (an Olympics the Eastern Block counties boycotted) and repeat two gold medals in 1988 Olympics in Seoul. But, other athletes were not so lucky. Some of those who missed the 1980 games never had another chance to shine. This boycott hurt the wrong people, taking a toll on prominent athletes more than the country it targeted.
    Louganis goes on to say that there are better ways to make the point, and I agree with pretty much all that he says.  A call for a boycott would be far more persuasive to me if you had the support of the people who will be most hurt by the boycott -- the athletes.  

    In my view, if you want to bring about change in Russia, it would be far more effective for us to attend and give  athletes -- including LGBT athletes -- a chance to shine at the Olympics.  

    The best argument against Hitler's view of the superiority of the "Aryan race" at the 1936 Olympics was Jesse Owens.  The best argument our country can make against the Russian position on LGBT people is to give LGBT athletes a chance to be stars in Russia.  The  athletes themselves are the best argument against the Russian position.

    •  I saw Greg compete live at the LA games (5+ / 0-)

      Attending the 1984 LA Olympic Games, as a spectator, was one of the most memorable experiences in my life. The Olympics is an amazingly inspirational event. I agree with Greg, we should definitely not boycott the Winter Games in Russia.

      "let's talk about that"

      by VClib on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 05:04:26 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  Louganis and others.. (3+ / 0-)

      Can be respected for their opinion.   There are several of these that I have read that read "it only hurts the athletes".   This is -somewhat true- (though nothing at all stops the IOC from just moving the Olympics to an alternate site, in fact, IOC has had emergency plans for such a kind of thing in the past.  While a hurried Olympics in Calgary or Norway wouldn't be ideal, nothing makes it technically impossible... and why would such a thing make sense?

      Because the Olympics at this point isn't about the Athletic endeavor.. I mean, it is, but combinations of world records and other tournaments make it a "big" event, but not the only event.  What it is spectacular at is making money for the host country.   Tourism goes up.  Companies spend large swaths of money there... NBC estimates more then $1B will be spent in Russia by media outlets alone.

      So, while the concept is 'you don't hurt Russia", it removes from Russia a significant cash windfall, and that isn't nothing... nor is it important for them to be rewarded for such policies.

      Gandhi's Seven Sins: Wealth without work; Pleasure without conscience; Knowledge without character; Commerce without morality; Science without humanity; Worship without sacrifice; Politics without principle

      by Chris Reeves on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 06:17:59 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

  •  Look at the creepy, totalitarian Beijing Olympics. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    3rock

    There is no question that Russia deserves to be punished for their mistreatment of LBGT people, but I am not convinced that a boycott is the best way to do that.

    In 2008, China walked away from their Olympics, which were supposed to be a big celebration of their country, with a huge black eye. Nobody boycotted them, but there were protests and stories about their oppression of dissidents, their grotesque air pollution problem, their demolition of neighborhoods, and their general totalitarian creepiness, all throughout the global media.

    If the US had boycotted, the story wouldn't have been about China. It would have been about the mean old United States picking on China, and who are we to lecture anybody, blah blah blah. Instead, there were the relay torch protests and the stories from the press, and the focus stayed on China.

    I don't think we should boycott the Olympics. I think our officials should maintain a cool, official line, while the rainbow flags and celebratory kisses make the point.

    Art is the handmaid of human good.

    by joe from Lowell on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 07:46:12 PM PDT

    •  Thank You for posting this. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      joe from Lowell

          Then why didn't we boycott China… & how that will play?
          One of the coolest things about DKOS is WE have discussions about things & the blanks get filled in.
           I commented recently (a shortened version    :)  
          ……. I caught one title of a diary that I have still yet to read "What if all the people attending the Olympics came with Rainbow Flags?" I.e rainbowed everything, I can think of.
          It's simply brilliant.
          I remember 1978 and the Anita Bryant Briggs Boycott. I was a member of Act Up, Queer Nation.
          I applaud your efforts. I only too well remember, though it was not the crushing point of the GREAT Iran RIPOFF of Carter's defeat, the boycott of the 80' Olympics DID NOT HELP. We now have a President whose went albatross. I mean WAY albatross. 2014 elections: Dears, you leave an opening, the repukes WILL twist it. They did in 1980, they controll the media. They will in 2014.
          As an older gay, sometimes it's better to consider ebb & flow. FULL ON, can backfire. There are other things to consider. Like ALL of Europe got RIPPED with bundled faulty mortgages. Do we now compound & rip their aspiring athletes, i.e. pride?
          We are talking about the winter Olympics, though in Europe, still, rich people skiing.
          I put some thought to it: At least the Russians cuffed their oligarchs,  better than we've done here. I think boycotting would be like refilling the oligarchs champaign glasses on the balcony.
          Let em eat caviar where it comes from :)
          Also someone commented in another diary, showing past historical polling, that this anti Gay is a new whatever. I think it will only reinforce peoples mindwashed hatred of. REPEATING; I think it will only reinforce peoples mindwashed hatred of.
          One of the most memorable things I've ever seen was the shaming of the chancellor of Davis University. Putin could use a shaming.
          P.S. Horace, You look great. How cool :)

      March AGAINST monsatanOagentorange 3/25/13 a time warp

      by 3rock on Sun Aug 18, 2013 at 11:49:30 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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